HC Deb 03 December 1975 vol 901 cc1674-5
13. Mr. Douglas-Mann

asked the Secretary of State for the Environment when he expects to make a final decision about the extension of the M23 motorway.

Dr. Gilbert

This will depend upon the outcome of the discussions with the Greater London Council, to which my right hon. Friend referred in his recent statement on the Greater London Development Plan.

Mr. Douglas-Mann

Is not it time that my hon. Friend acknowledged that the urban motorway is as obsolete as high-rise flats? Since Westway was pushed through North Kensington, the environmental standards required to build over motorways have made them impossibly expensive, even when we do not have financial stringency. The final extension of the M23 makes sense only if we are to have orbital roads, which clearly we are not. Surely my hon. Friend could now announce that this final extension is not to be built. Will he consider some form of intermediate road—a Ringway 2½—to link up round the south-west and south-east of London, rather than the motorway programme?

Dr. Gilbert

I have no difficulty in accepting my hon. Friend's general remarks about urban motorways, but he will be aware that the Greater London Development Plan mentions the need for better orbital movement in outer London, and certainly in South London. He is right in saying that the decision where the M23 shall terminate must depend on considerations of that kind and also on decisions about the way in which non-orbital traffic shall disperse more easily on to the secondary road network in the area in which the M23 terminates.

Mr. Geoffrey Finsberg

Does the hon. Gentleman accept that the conclusions arising out of the decision of the Secretary of State on the development plan leave an untidy gap, and that people are still wondering whether, in the end, this Government will press ahead with more motorways in spite of their public protestations to the contrary?

Dr. Gilbert

I am aware of the public concern. This is one unsatisfactory feature of the planning requirements which surrounds the Greater London Development Plan. It is a situation that we hope never to have to struggle with again. I again give the assurance that our policy on urban motorways has not changed.

Mr. Jay

Is my hon. Friend aware that there is a great deal of feeling in South London about the uncertainty caused by this indecision, and that in this case he could both save a great deal of public money and please a great many people if he cancelled this extension altogether?

Dr. Gilbert

I am, indeed, well aware of the public concern that has existed for many years in South London. I have already had informal discussions with the Chairman of the Transport Committee of the GLC about precisely where the M23 will terminate. I hope that we shall have further detailed discussions shortly.