§ 6. Mr. Gryllsasked the Secretary of State for Trade what consultations he has had with the Confederation of British Industry with regard to improving British exports.
§ Mr. ShoreI have discussed a number of matters with the Confederation of British Industry, including exports and related trade issues. The British Overseas Trade Board has had similar discussions.
§ Mr. GryllsHas the right hon. Gentleman had discussions about arms sales to Chile? Will he come clean, stop hiding behind a smoke screen of secrecy and tell us how many hundreds of millions of pounds' worth of exports are being lost by the Government's silly ban when we need all the exports we can possibly get at present?
§ Mr. ShoreThe hon. Gentleman's figures are grossly exaggerated and are based upon his own rather heated imagination rather than upon any facts available to us. He knows the situation with 1207 regard to arms sales to Chile. It has been stated in this House.
§ Mr. CarterWill my right hon. Friend tell us how many millions of pounds in trade this country might have lost if arms sales to Chile had gone ahead?
§ Mr. Tom KingIn discussions with the CBI, what was the right hon. Gentleman able to say about any ideas he has for promoting British exports?
§ Mr. ShoreI have had considerable talks with the CBI, both directly myself and through my officials and officials of the CBI. One of the main focuses of our talks has been how far the British Overseas Trade Board's activities can promote British exports and how its work and the work of the CBI can be brought closer together and made more effective
§ Mr. HeseltineWill the right hon. Gentleman comment on reports that among the activities he has been indulging in is to tell the ECGD, two weeks ago, that it should not give further support to certain countries of which he disapproves? Does he think that such activities help our trade?
§ Mr. GryllsOn a point of order, Mr. Speaker. In view of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I beg to give notice that I shall seek to raise the matter on the Adjournment at the earliest opportunity.
§ 10. Mr. Stanleyasked the Secretary of State for Trade whether he is satisfied with the financing assistance available to the purchasers of British exports.
§ Mr. ShoreYes. Sir. The financial facilities available for British exports are at once extensive and broadly competitive.
§ Mr. StanleyIn view of the oblique reply to my right hon. Friend a few moments ago, will the Secretary of State give the House a categorical assurance that it is not the Government's intention to make ECGD finance available on a politically selective basis?
§ Mr. ShoreIf I am asked for a categorical assurance in relation to an article that appeared in the Economist alleging that I had asked for a list of export deals covering a number of countries and that I had prevented them from going ahead, the answer is "No".
§ Mr. StanleyAnswer the question.
§ Mr. Tom BoardmanWill the right hon. Gentleman now answer the question? Will he give a categorical assurance that no instructions are being given affecting credit facilities for exports to countries of whose Governments the right hon. Gentleman does not approve? Will he answer that?
§ Mr. ShoreI am not prepared to give an answer in those terms. As the Minister responsible for the ECGD, it is not right for me to limit my rights in relation to the ECGD. What I am able to give the House is a categorical assurance that the article that appeared in the Economist was false.
§ Mr. Hugh FraserThe right hon. Gentleman can clear up this matter quite easily if he will assure the House that he will make a statement to the House about any individual case in which he decides to take political action against an exporter or importer. If not, by administrative action he will be doing what he is accused of doing by the Economist. If he will assure the House that he will tell us if he takes such an action, we shall be able to debate it.
§ Mr. ShoreI am happy to give the right hon. Gentleman that assurance. If, with my colleagues, I decide to restrict ECGD transactions in relation to particular countries, I have no doubt that I shall want to make a statement to the House about that.
§ Mr. LoughlinIs not the right hon. Gentleman aware that successive Conservative administrations have taken decisions about financing and about trade itself on the basis of political opinions, and have done so over the whole postwar period?
§ Mr. ShoreOf course there have been many occasions when Governments have had to intervene in trade matters. Anyone who knows the ECGD Act and who studies it carefully will appreciate that 1209 certain provisions provide that there has to be an element of judgment about what kind of credit facilities should be available.
Mr. HeseitineWill the right hon. Gentleman tell the House whether he has had conversations with officials in the ECGD in order to put himself in a position to take action enabling him to discriminate against countries of whose regimes he disapproves?
§ Mr. ShoreI shall certainly not tell the hon. Gentleman about conversations that I may or may not have had with members of my own Department.
§ Mr. HeseltineOpen government!
§ Mr. ShoreNot at all: that does not relate to the issue of open government. The right hon. Member for Stafford and Stone (Mr. Fraser) made the perfectly reasonable request that if we made changes in ECGD we should inform the House. I shall be glad to do that.