Norton Villiers Triumph

HC Deb 09 December 1974 vol 883 cc9-13

8. Mr. Stanley

asked the Secretary of State for Industry what assistance he is going to offer to the Meriden Workers' Co-operative and to Norton Villiers Triumph Ltd. under the Industry Act 1972; and whether he will make a statement.

5. Mr. Hordern

asked the Secretary of State for Industry if he has any further proposals for the Triumph Norton Villiers works at Meriden; and if he will make a statement.

19. Mr. Norman Lamont

asked the Secretary of State for Industry whether he will make a further statement about the Meriden Workers' Co-operative for the manufacture of Triumph motor cycles.

22. Mrs. Renée Short

asked the Secretary of State for Industry if he will make a statement about the future of Norton Villiers Triumph, Wolverhampton.

Mr. Benn

The conclusion of the negotiations between NVT and the proposed workers' co-operative at Meriden relating to the offer of assistance to the co-operative which I announced on 29th July was made dependent by NVT on the acquiesence of the workers at NVT Birmingham, which was not forthcoming. I am now considering fresh proposals submitted by NVT and the trade unions concerned. Meanwhile the offer to Meriden still stands and is acceptable to the workers at NVT, Wolverhampton.

Mr. Stanley

If the right. hon. Gentleman should decide in the next few days to seek the consent of the House for a greater contribution of public funds to NVT than the £4.82 million arranged in 1973, will he acknowledge that that greater liability will have arisen directly and solely on account of his personal determination to sustain at public expense a non-viable workers' co-operative even if it means jeopardising the rest of the motor cycle industry?

Mr. Benn

The hon. Gentleman is quite wrong in that analysis. The tragic and unnecessary decline in the British motor cycle industry was accelerated by the foolish decision of the previous Government to assent to an arrangement which led to the closure at Meriden. Even the previous Government had begun discussions with the workers at Meriden about a possible co-operative. I believe that if all three plants could produce, as they could, the equivalent of only 15 days' output alone by Honda in Japan, there is scope for seeing whether we can make a better go of this industry.

Mrs. Short

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the Wolverhampton works employs about 1,500 people, many of whom are my constituents, and that they are very concerned about the future of the industry, particularly about the hardships suffered by the workers at the Meriden works for such a long time? Is my right hon. Friend further aware that they are very anxious to see that representatives of workers from the three factories are brought together to hammer out an agreement for the organisation of the three factories? Is he aware that they have great confidence in the future of the British motor cycle industry and feel that they have a great contribution to make to its future? Will he act on these lines as soon as possible?

Mr. Benn

I share my hon. Friend's confidence that this industry has a much greater part to play in our own industrial performance and in exports than it has been able to play, for one reason or another, over the last few years.

After my meeting in Small Heath I undertook to the workers that I would consider what they said to me, which derives from their anxieties. The unions are setting up tripartite meetings to bring together workers from the three plants, and I look forward to receiving their representations. To divide the workers in this industry at this time would be a great and unnecessary tragedy.

Mr. Lamont

Is the Secretary of State aware that the answer which he gave to my hon. Friend the Member for Ton-bridge and Mailing (Mr. Stanley) ignores the fundamental realities of the situation? Is it not the case that the history of the Meriden plant has been one of low productivity and continual interruptions to production—

Mr. Leslie Huckfield

Rubbish!

Mr. Lamont

—and that that has had a bad effect on the British motor cycle industry? Is not the right hon. Gentleman aware that, unless that fact is recognised, this attempt to save the industry will go down the same road as all other attempts have gone?

Mr. Benn

The hon. Gentleman puts forward a view which I cannot accept and which I do not believe the facts justify. The British motor cycle industry, which was world famous, has progressively declined. At this moment, with the world energy crisis leading to a demand for motor cycles, as a nation we are unable, for reasons which we need not go into now, to meet this demand. There is nothing whatsoever wrong in the Government turning their mind to see how we can re-enter that market and how we can acquire a share in it, which properly belongs to the skilled workers who produce the cycles.

Mr. Tomlinson

Does my right hon. Friend agree that a large number of Opposition Members would rather see the Meriden co-operative fail as an exercise in worker participation than see it succeed? Does he accept that they are putting obstacles in its way by making outrageous accusations about labour relations in the past? Is it not a fact that there is a tremendous demand for the product from the Meriden motor-cycle works and that if this situation is not resolved quickly the valuable American market will be lost?

Mr. Benn

I share my hon. Friend's views about the market. This industry, first under Sir Bernard Docker and then under Lord Shawcross, employing various consultants some of whom said that we should close down Small Heath in 1971 and that we should close down Meriden in 1973, has never had a chance to develop its capability. I intend to see whether the possibility is open to the industry.

Mr. Heseltine

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that if he delays much longer there will be no industry left to seize the opportunities of which he is talking? Will he confirm what he well knows, that the right hon. Christopher Chataway, the former Minister for Industrial Development, made it clear that he would not support a works' co-operative, and that the reason why the Secretary of State is considering proposals from NVT for the nationalisation of the industry is that NVT can see no other way forwards, in view of the intervention by the right hon. Gentleman which has brought the industry to a situation in which there is no other way forward?

Mr. Benn

The hon. Gentleman is wrong. Let me make it clear that the offer I made to the Meriden co-operative in the summer is still open. It is open to NVT now—in the light of what I have said today about our interest in considering proposals which have come forward from the company and from the workers, as we are doing—to establish this industry on a three-plant basis. We have undertaken to consider very seriously NVT's corporate plans, which has been before us in outline, and also the proposals which have come from the three groups of workers meeting together. It will be possible to make a fresh start if the three-plant beginning can take place with the Meriden co-operative against the background of those studies.

Mr. Huckfield

Is my right hon Friend aware that the real failure of Meriden has been the failure of management to ensure that the factory has an adequate supply of component parts? Is he further aware that many of my constituents who have been occupying the factory since September 1973, many of whom have given everything because they want to make motor cycles, are grateful for the attitude he has adopted throughout? Does he accept that this is a project for a worker co-operative which has been given detailed and careful study and research, and that at least it deserves to be given a chance to show that workers have a rôle to play in running their factories?

Mr. Benn

On the subject of workers' co-operatives, my hon. Friend knows my view and the interest which I have taken. Despite the sharp words which have been uttered this afternoon, I hope the House will think it right to endorse the idea that the industry should be given a fresh start on a three-plant basis with the good will of the people concerned, given the fact that it is an industry in which Britain could do very much better than, for whatever reason, it has been able to do in the past.