HC Deb 20 November 1973 vol 864 cc1111-3
10. Mr. John E. B. Hill

asked the Minister of State for Defence what are the criteria by which parents serving in the Armed Forces are enabled to send their children to independent schools; what financial or other assistance is available; and how many children of officers and of other ranks have been so assisted in the last 10 years, distinguishing, if known, between boys and girls and types of schools.

Mr. Ian Gilmour

The children of members of the Armed Forces are liable to suffer from interruptions in their education because their parents are subject to frequent postings at home and overseas. Boarding school allowance may therefore be paid to Service parents to assist them to send their children to boarding schools, but only if they remain for a complete stage of education, so as to ensure continuity of education.

The current annual rates of boarding school allowances are: up to £399 for the first child, up to £477 for the second and up to £573 for the third and subsequent children in each family. For the summer term 1973, boarding school allowance was paid in respect of about 16,500 children of officers and 5,000 children of Service men. I regret that the other information sought by my hon. Friend is not available.

Mr. Hill

I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for putting the facts on record. Has my right hon. Friend's attention been drawn to a statement by the hon. Member for Birmingham, Spark-brook (Mr. Hattersley) in the television programme broadcast in September that these allowances were not available to other ranks under the last administration? If that is untrue, will my right hon. Friend do his best to correct it?

Mr. Gilmour

Yes. I can tell my hon. Friend that my attention has been drawn to it. I ventured to draw the attention of the hon. Member for Birmingham, Sparkbrook (Mr. Hattersley) to his misstatement in a letter which I wrote him on 2nd October. What the hon. Gentleman said was flatly wrong and I very much regret that he has not availed himself of my invitation before now to set the record straight.

Mr. Hattersley

Of course I know, without qualification, that grants for boarding education are available to all ranks in the Services at the same level and that all ranks take them up. But in the light of the figures which the right hon. Gentleman gave today and those which he gave to my hon. Friend the Member for Barrow-in-Furness (Mr. Booth) on 14th November, does the right hon. Gentleman still suggest that equal opportunity for boarding education exists in Her Majesty's Forces?

Mr. Gilmour

I very much regret that the hon. Gentleman has continued his evasive tactics. He made a flat statement in saying: When I was a Minister in the Ministry of Defence we enabled officers in Her Majesty's Forces to send their children to independent schools. But, alas, we did not make that possible for other ranks That was flatly wrong, and it is unfortunate that the hon. Gentleman has not seen fit to correct his mistake. [HON. MEMBERS: "Withdraw."] The House will regret that the hon. Gentleman is so careless of his own reputation.

Mr. Judd

The right hon. Gentleman speaks of evasiveness. Why does he not give a direct answer? Are the same opportunities open to children of other ranks as those which are open to the children of officers?

Mr. Gilmour

The answer is clear from what I said originally. Exactly the same allowance is paid to officers as to other Service men.

Mr. Jeffrey Archer

Is not the truth of the matter that the opportunities are there but that they are not taken up by other ranks?

Mr. Gilmour

That is partly true. But many Service men are not so anxious for their children to have boarding-school education as many officers are. But we must not evade the main point, which is that before a large television audience the hon. Member for Sparkbrook made a flatly untrue statement and he still refuses to withdraw it.

Mr. Arthur Lewis

As the Government and their supporters for so long have been in favour of means-tested benefits, may I ask whether both officers and other ranks are means-tested before getting these grants?

Mr. Gilmour

No. These benefits are not means-tested. I am interested to hear from Opposition Members that, contrary to what the hon. Member for Sparkbrook seems to be suggesting, they are in favour of more children being sent to independent schools.