HC Deb 03 May 1973 vol 855 cc1438-9
5. Mr. Spriggs

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he will consider introducing legislation to amend Section 75 of the Criminal Justice Act 1967 with a view to assisting the courts and defendants who feel unable to conduct their own defence and who lack the financial means to engage a legal advocate.

Mr. Carlisle

No, Sir. Courts have discretion to grant legal aid when they think legal representation is desirable in the interests of justice and that the defendant requires assistance in meeting its cost.

Mr. Spriggs

Is the hon. and learned Gentleman aware that at present poor people who apply for legal aid are sometimes refused on the ground that the charges against them are of only a minor character? Because many such persons are inarticulate, or because no matter how well-educated a defendant may be he naturally freezes in the presence of a court for the first time, surely it is in the interests of British justice that a defendant who claims he is innocent should be given the opportunity of providing the courts with proper evidence. In that way the courts could come to a proper decision. On those grounds alone will the Minister think again about the answer he has given and offer defendants the chance of being defended in a proper manner?

Mr. Carlisle

Discretion under Section 75 is as wide as it can be. It is that legal aid should be granted where it appears to the court desirable to do so in the interests of justice. There are then the criteria recommended by the committee under Lord Widgery and about which the Home Office recently reminded the courts in a circular. That said in particular that legal aid should be granted where the liberty, livelihood and reputation of the accused were in real jeopardy. Use of the grant of legal aid is going up enormously in magistrates' courts. Last year, for example, 83.7 per cent. of all applications were granted.

Mr. Alexander W. Lyon

As any legal-aided defendant has to make a substantial contribution if he has sufficient assets, is there now any reason why he should not be allowed legal aid as of right?

Mr. Carlisle

It is true that the courts have power to make a contribution order when granting legal aid, but if the hon. Member is seriously suggesting that everyone who appears in court, whether it be for a parking offence, or a speeding offence, or whatever, should, as of right, be entitled to be represented at the cost of the State, I do not agree with him.

Mr. Spriggs

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. In view of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I beg to give notice that I shall seek to raise the matter on the Adjournment at the earliest possible moment.