§ 19. Mr. Biggs-Davisonasked the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether he will deduct from aid funds for Zambia and Tanzania amounts sufficient to compensate victims in Rhodesia of terrorist operations mounted or sustained from those countries.
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeNo, Sir.
§ Mr. Biggs-DavisonHave not Rhodesians, black and white, who are in our law British subjects been murdered by terrorists trained in Tanzania and staged through Zambia? What must be the feeling of the bereaved when these two countries are offered unqualified aid by the United Kingdom?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeThe victims and their relations will understand that the United Kingdom aid programme to any country is geared to the development of that country and is designed to increase stability. Therefore, this issue must be separate from any question of compensation to victims of terrorism.
§ Mr. MolloyIs not the truth that this current phase in Rhodesian development and its effect on neighbouring countries arises because of the activities of a number of treacherous and disloyal people? Does the Foreign Secretary agree that the question from the hon. Member for Chigwell (Mr. Biggs-Davison) is almost equivalent to seeking reparation for former Fascist countries because of the activities of British forces in the last war?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeThat point is pretty far-fetched. However, I am quite clear in my mind that we must not mix up development aid with compensation for victims of terrorism.
§ Mrs. HartWill the Foreign Secretary be in a position fairly soon to tell us what extra aid is proposed by the British Government for Zambia as a direct result of the effects of the conflict with Rhodesia, particularly as the Canadian Government have just announced £3 million of aid to help specifically for this reason in the light of the United Nations recommendation?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeThe Canadian Government have announced an extra £3 million aid, but their existing aid programme is small. My noble Friend in another place has announced an extra £1 million interest-free loan for Zambia for road transport equipment and this is in addition to the aid programme now running at £7 million a year, the bulk of it on technical assistance. We are also helping with financial arrangements for the Kariba North power station, in the form of £14,650,000 over 18 years, and we are paying pensions for British overseas civil servants for which the Zambian Government were previously responsible. The whole thing adds up to a very large aid programme.
§ Mr. Biggs-DavisonIs it not a matter of history that terrorist operations against Rhodesia from north of the Zambesi began before UDI?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeThere always has been a certain amount of terrorism on that frontier, but lately it has been stepped up.
§ 20. Mr. Whiteheadasked the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what representations he has made to the Smith régime in Rhodesia concerning the further harassment and arrests of members of the African National Council who have opposed the collection of signatures for a document purporting to convey African reappraisal of the Pearce proposals.
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeThe Rhodesians have indicated that the detentions of African National Council leaders were made for security reasons and that the cases will be considered by the Judicial Review Tribunal. As I indicated to the House on 28th February, I have taken the matter up with the Rhodesian authorities and have urged that they 430 should be brought to trial if there is evidence against them.
§ Mr. WhiteheadAlthough the equally deplorable trial of Mr. Niesewand has attracted more publicity, the arrest of Mr. Chadzingwa and Mr. Ngcebetsha was equally deplorable and was, I believe, because they had been advising Africans not to sign the bogus document that is being circulated as a counter-balance to the Pearce Report by the Rhodesian Government. If that document ever comes to London will the Foreign Secretary undertake to treat it with the contempt it deserves, and will he make further strong protests to the Rhodesian Government about the detention of these two men in particular, because they are in very poor health?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeI have made representations about the two mn. I do not know how to treat a document which I have not seen until I see it.
§ Mr. HaselhurstShould it not be made clear to Mr. Smith that for this House to be satisfied that the test of acceptability has been fulfilled he will have to do rather more than collect signatures; that he must show that there is some accord between his Government and the political organs of African opinion?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeIt had been our hope that Mr. Smith would get in touch with and talk with the various representatives of African opinion in Rhodesia, and also that the process would move the other way and that Bishop Muzorewa and his supporters would get in touch with Mr. Smith so that consultations could take place.
§ Mr. RichardWill the Foreign Secretary re-emphasise that the test of acceptability is for this House. It is for us and not Mr. Smith to be satisfied that the proposals are acceptable to the Rhodesians as a whole.
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeIt is certainly not for Mr. Smith to be satisfied; it is for the British Government, because it is we who have to bring proposals to this House.
§ 23. Mr. Maclennanasked the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs if he will make a statement about developments in Rhodesia.
§ 27. Mr. Molloyasked the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs if he will make a further statement on Rhodesia.
§ 36. Mr. Haselhurstasked the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether there have been any further contacts between Her Majesty's Government and the Smith régime in Rhodesia; and if he will make a statement.
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeI have nothing to add to the reply which I gave hon. Members on 28th February.— [Vol. 851, c. 1482–3.]
§ Mr. MaclennanDoes the right hon. Gentleman agree that the pressure which is being exercised within Rhodesia on the African National Congress makes it more difficult to judge the attitude of that organisation to any possible proposals for settlement and to determine whether it is a free attitude? Does he further agree that there is a serious risk that if the ANC is subjected to these pressures it will cease to operate in a free atmosphere and will cease to command the respect of the outside world as the voice of the Rhodesian people? Will he therefore make representations to the Smith régime to the effect that it should take its hands off the ANC?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeI have said that I have made representations on behalf of the members of the ANC. I have asked Mr. Smith, if there is evidence against them, to bring them to trial. In general I agree with the hon. Gentleman.
§ Mr. HaselhurstDoes my right hon. Friend feel that the European citizens of Rhodesia fully appreciate what this House will require before a settlement can take place? Is not one of the greatest obstacles to a settlement the present leader of the régime in Salisbury?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeMr. Smith does lead the régime and exercise the authority. Any settlement that is made has to be made with Mr. Smith, among others. I must emphasise that the important thing now is that the initiative should come from Rhodesia, and all parties in Rhodesia.
§ Mr. MolloyDoes the right hon. Gentleman not agree that sanction- 432 breaking, the use of the British flag by some ships engaged in sanction-breaking, the case of Mr. Peter Niesewand and the situation with Zambia call for serious examination? Does he not agree that the Government must keep an extraordinarily close eye on all these things and take whatever action is necessary, in whatever appropriate institution?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeYes. I noticed, looking at the figures on sanctions, that last year Rhodesia exported 240 million dollars' worth of goods to countries other than South Africa and imported 210 million dollars' worth of goods from countries other than South Africa. We have made 18 prosecutions, while practically no other country has prosecuted. Our sanctions story is at least good. This is what is happening.
§ Rear-Admiral Morgan-GilesWill my right hon. Friend continue patiently trying to explain to hon. Members on both sides of the House that Africa is not Hampstead?
§ Sir Alec Douglas-HomeI think that hon. Members have taken the point.