HC Deb 22 January 1973 vol 849 cc31-3
Mr. Benn

(by Private Notice) asked the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry to make a statement on the current state of negotiations with Pan Am and other United States airlines which have taken out options to purchase Concorde; about the conversion of these options to firm orders; and on the discussions Her Majesty's Government have had with the United States Administration about landing rights for this aircraft in the United States of America.

The Minister for Aerospace and Shipping (Mr. Michael Heseltine)

The manufacturers are in detailed negotiations with Pan American. Negotiations are also proceeding between the manufacturers and other American option holders. The manufacturers hope to convert these options into firm orders as soon as possible. The negotiations are, however, as the right hon. Member will appreciate, inevitably complex and detailed and it is not possible for me to indicate when they will result in firm decisions.

There has been a continuous series of discussions between British, French and American officials on Concorde matters. I also took the opportunity during my recent visit to the United States to discuss Concorde operations with members of the United States Administration. The United States authorities are now considering any further noise rules that should govern the operation of commercial aircraft in the United States of America.

Mr. Benn

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for that answer, which obviously satisfies us that the statements that appeared in the Observer yesterday were quite inaccurate. The Opposition wish Sir George Edwards well in his mission and also hope that the negotiations with the American Government will be successful.

May I put two questions to the hon. Gentleman? First, as it would be absurd for temporary financial difficulties of Pan American or TWA or any other American airline to threaten the success of the project, are the Government ready to consider sympathetically special arrangements? Secondly, will the Minister represent in the strongest terms to the American Government that the British Government would not accept bans on the landing of Concorde in the United States that were motivated either by the interests of the United States aircraft industry or as a by-product of a domestic American campaign to prevent them from building their own SST?

Mr. Heseltine

I can confirm to the right hon. Gentleman that the statements made in one of yesterday's newspapers to the effect that the negotiations had come to an end were a fabrication. The whole House will wish all the best of good fortune to Sir George Edwards and the team from British Aircraft Corporation and Rolls-Royce who are now in New York having discussions with Pan American. The temporary financial difficulties of Pan American are for the board of Pan American, and I do not think that I can give the sort of assurance that the right hon. Gentleman seeks.

As to the right hon. Gentleman's second question about the position of the United States Government, I said in my main answer that I had had discussions with various parts of the United States Administration and that I had made quite clear the importance that the British Government and the French Government attach to the Concorde project. The United States Administration are now considering their position in regard to any further noise regulations they may wish to introduce, and it is for them to reach their own decisions.

Mr. Adley

How far is my hon. Friend prepared to go with our European partners to defend the future of the European aerospace industry? Following his recent visit, does my hon. Friend think that if Concorde were an American aircraft the attitude of the United States airlines and of the financial institutions in America would be the same towards it or different?

Mr. Heseltine

It is not at all helpful to the team from the British Aircraft Corporation for us to become involved in speculation of that type. There is a commercial discussion going on, and I would rather leave it in the hands of the manufacturers.

Mr. Pardoe

In the Minister's discussions in America did he have discussions about the regulations governing overflying at supersonic speeds of the American airspace? Will the hon. Gentleman now give a categoric assurance that Concorde in service will never be allowed to fly over any part of the United Kingdom at supersonic speeds?

Mr. Heseltine

The question of overflying American territory at supersonic speeds is a matter entirely for the American Government, who would have to make their own decisions in the light of any applications made to them by airlines that wished to do it. There is no intention on the part of the British flag carrier to do it. We have made it clear that in plenty of time for the introduction of commercial service by Concorde we will make up our minds about supersonic overflying in this country.

Mr. Michael McNair-Wilson

Would it not be a distortion to suggest that whether Pan American delays its options will somehow cast a complete shadow over this project? Is it not true that this airline is in considerable financial difficulty which it has to see its way out of before it can place orders?

Mr. Heseltine

It is very helpful for my hon. Friend to make that point, but he will no doubt understand that it is unhelpful for me as the Minister responsible for the company involved in these negotiations to become involved in the details of wider discussions at this time.

Mr. Palmer

Will the Minister tell the House whether the United Kingdom is likely to manufacture Concorde in the future at the same rate as is proposed in France, the figures for which were recently given to the French Chamber of Deputies?

Mr. Heseltine

That is a totally different question.