HC Deb 14 March 1972 vol 833 cc283-6
14. Mr. Ashley

asked the Secretary of State for Social Services what is his estimate of the number of people eligible to apply for an extra heating allowance; and how many are at present receiving one.

Mr. Dean

In November, 1970, 196,000 special additions for extra heating were in payment. Further figures reflecting the recently improved levels of these additions will be available in the spring. It is not possible to estimate the total numbers who might be eligible, since the eligibility of a long-term claimant depends upon the severity of his need and whether the sum of his special needs, including other things as well as heating, exceeds the long-term addition of 50p a week.

Mr. Ashley

Although the Minister may not be able to make a precise estimate of those eligible would he agree, from the figures that he has given, that there must be a considerable number who qualify but do not receive the allowance? Would he consider paying an automatic heating allowance during the winter to all supplementary pensioners?

Mr. Dean

Special additions are available under the existing arrangements, where there are special needs, but the existing arrangements are being reviewed. All the books of supplementary pensioners are being examined when they come up for renewal to see whether there is an eligibility which is not being taken up.

Dame Irene Ward

Will the Under-secretary bear in mind that this is a most urgent matter and that I hope every effort will be made to deal with it? I am not satisfied that those requiring extra heating are getting it. It would be absolutely marvellous if some of the Treasury officials were to come up to my part of the world, where I would take them to see cases of need. I am certain that it is the Treasury and not the Department of Health and Social Security which is not co-operating, and I would love to do something to help my hon. Friend the Under-Secretary to get on with the job.

Mr. Dean

I can assure my hon. Friend the Member for Tynemouth (Dame Irene Ward) that the Secretary of State is taking a great personal interest in this, as indeed is the Supplementary Benefits Commission. Arrangements are being looked at at the present moment, but I can add nothing to what I have already said.

Mr. Meacher

Less than 2 per cent. of all old people receive any special help with heating costs, and the vast majority of those who do get only 25p per week when average winter heating costs come to £2 per week or more. It is terribly mean to allow old people to shiver when the Government have given away £1.400 million in tax reliefs to the better-off, and are expected to give away a further £1,000 million in the next Budget. Will he look at the problem again?

Mr. Dean

I am confident that when we have the figures in the spring they will show a substantial increase in the numbers now benefiting from the improved arrangements that the Government introduced last winter.

Mr. O'Malley

How can the Minister be so self-satisfied about the scheme, with all the defects in current circumstances that my hon. Friend has described? Did not the Secretary of State and the Under-Secretary promise the House before Christmas that a review would be put in hand urgently? We have had no announcement about it. Does not the hon. Gentleman recognise that, as the delegates from the Lancashire Federation of Trades Unions pointed out to him only this morning, for many pensioners the choice is between adequate heating and adequate food, and that because of the inflation produced by this Government, throughout this winter hundreds of thousands of pensioners have not had enough money for the heating they need?

Mr. Dean

We are certainly not self-satisfied, but we had to start from scratch, because very little was done by the Administration of which the hon. Gentleman was a member.

18. Mr. Eadie

asked the Secretary of State for Social Services how many pensioners applied for additional financial aid for heating as a consequence of increased costs to them because of the miners' strike; and what was the total cost involved in the respective geographical areas.

Mr. Dean

I regret that this information is not available.

Mr. Eadie

Is there a problem of organisation here? The Minister must be aware that during the miners' strike it seemed to be easy to identify pensioners who were suffering because of the additional cost of heating. If it were possible to identify them then, how will the hon. Gentleman identify them now?

Mr. Dean

The information is not available now, partly because during the pressure of the strike it was not possible for our local offices to take down this detailed information. Discovering the additional cost often depends on quarterly bills which the people concerned have not yet received.

Mr. Bruce-Gardyne

Does not my hon. Friend agree that there is something a little unappetising about those who were vociferous in demanding the most inflationary settlement possible for the miners' strike now complaining about the impact of that settlement on pensioners?

Mr. Dean

I agree very much with what my hon. Friend has said, and I had better not be drawn further.

Mr. Bob Brown

I am sure that the Minister will agree that that type of carping will not increase the comfort of pensioners who will be receiving extremely large quarterly accounts as a result of having to employ electric heating instead of solid fuel. Will he give an assurance that pensioners who receive an extra large electricity account as a direct result of using alternative heating during the strike period will be assisted by the Supplementary Benefits Commission?

Mr. Dean

The hon. Gentleman is being unfair to my hon. Friend. The fact is that there was hardship among pensioners as a result of the strike, and that is why I have given the House an assurance this afternoon that help will be given in cases where higher additional costs have been incurred because of the shortage of normal fuel.