HC Deb 31 July 1972 vol 842 cc289-92

4.30 a.m.

Mr. Millan

I beg to move Amendment No. 38, in page 14, line 43, at end insert: '(4) In the said Act, subsection (2) of section 5 shall cease to have effect'. This Amendment deals with a matter raised in Committee at which the Minister said he would look again. Section 5(2) of the Local Employment Act, 1972, provides that whereas the Secretary of State has power to provide premises in a development area or an intermediate area for occupation by undertakings carried on or to be carried on there, this power does not apply except to industrial buildings. We said in Committee that with the increased emphasis on encouraging service industries and office employment in the development areas it no longer seemed sensible to have this restriction on the power of the Secretary of State—that he might just as well wish to acquire and have available for occupation an office building or a building that could be used for some service industry, and the building would not then be an industrial building.

We were not trying to involve the Secretary of State in running offices, hotels, and so on, as I think he feared when we put down that Amendment. Our purpose was simply to give the Secretary of State the power to have that kind of building available as well as the industrial building. That is our purpose now, and I hope that the Amendment will be accepted.

Mr. Anthony Grant

As the hon. Gentleman says, a very similar Amendment was considered in Committee on 13th July. The hon. Gentleman made it clear then, and he certainly has made it clear now, that it is not his intention that the Government should become involved in running hotels, shops and other non-idustrial premises but rather that they should be able to provide commercial premises for letting. It was on this basis that my right hon. Friend agreed to look again at the proposal.

I am advised that by Section 5 of the Local Employment Act the Secretary of State already has power to acquire land in order to provide commercial premises. On occasion, non-industrial premises, such as post offices, are erected on industrial estates. What the Secretary of State may not do is to acquire existing non-industrial buildings, such as hotels, and run them as such, or let them to others. He may acquire such premises, though, if he wishes to redevelop the property to provide, for example, a new factory estate. The present powers in the Local Employment Act are sufficient to meet the intention which I understand lies behind the Amendment.

As my right hon. Friend made clear in Committee, we are certainly averse to taking the additional power if, as it seems possible, it would extend the field of Government as landlord of a variety of enterprises such as shops and hotels. But I do not believe that that is what the hon. Gentleman wants. The Government's central rôle is to provide factories, and both sides are probably agreed on this point. I hope that what I have said about the Secretary of State's existing powers will reassure the hon. Gentleman.

Mr. Millan

I am not quite sure that the powers go as far as I would like them to go. I understand that what the Minister is saying is that the powers exist to acquire a building for redevelopment. What I am not clear about is whether the powers exist for acquisition in order to have available premises for letting as commercial premises—

Mr. Grant

Yes.

Mr. Millan

The answer to that point being "Yes", I am quite happy that that should be so, and I hope that the powers will be used in that way. With that assurance, I beg to ask leave to withdraw the Amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Mr. Millan

I beg to move, Amendment No. 54, in page 15, line 23, after 'State', insert 'to own land or'.

The Clause deals with powers of the industrial estates corporations. In Committee a number of my hon. Friends made the point that as well as having power to manage or develop land, there were circumstances in which it would be desirable that the industrial estates corporations have a general power to own land.

That was the purpose of an Amendment moved in Committee. The Minister said that he would look at the matter again. This Amendment gives him the opportunity to do so. I am not quite sure about the circumstances in which an industrial estates corporation would wish to use this power, but there seems no particular reason why it should not have the power to own land, and that is what the Amendment would give it.

Mr. Anthony Grant

As my right hon. Friend explained in Committee when the similar Amendment was proposed, since 1960 the Government have been the authority who acquire the land which the estate corporations require. The land acquired is leased to the corporations concerned. This system has worked satisfactorily for the purpose of the factory programme, but it is arguable whether it gives rise to unnecessary administrative and legal work.

My right hon. Friend said that we were examining the functions of the corporations. One of the points we were looking at was the possibility of simplifying the relationship between the corporations and the Department.

But after further consideration we have decided that amendment to this end is not needed. Considerable public funds are provided for the purchase of land for factory building and it is important to ensure adequate control over their expenditure. If the estate corporations were to be allowed to acquire land freehold, that power would have to be made subject to the direction and control of the Secretary of State and, in practical terms, the corporations would have no more freedom than they have now under the leasing system.

On a drafting point, to ensure adequate control we should need Amendments more complicated than the rather simple change proposed in this Amendment. However, I assure the hon. Gentleman and the House that we believe that he has a good point and that there is a case for endeavouring to speed up the process of factory building, if necessary acquiring advance land very speedily. That does not mean that I support the view of acquiring great land banks, but of speeding up the process of factory building.

With regard to simplifying the procedures between the Department and the corporations, my advice is that it will be possible by administrative means to do this without the need for legislative changes, and that is the course that we shall adopt.

Mr. Millan

I am glad that the Minister has recognised that there is a genuine point here. I am also glad to have his assurance that he feels that this can be dealt with without changing the legislation. With that assurance, I beg to ask leave to withdraw the Amendment

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

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