§ 25. Mr. Goldingasked the Minister of State for Defence what are the minimum rates for male labourers for a standard working week in Royal Ordnance Factories.
§ Mr. G Johnson SmithThe minimum rate for adult male labourers is £17.30, 896 but 97 per cent. of labourers in the Royal Ordnance Factories are on the next higher rate of £17.95.
§ Mr. GoldingIs the hon. Gentleman aware that the House will be shocked to hear that wages of £17 are being paid for a standard working week for men employed in Royal Ordnance factories? Is he aware that that is far below the comparable rates in both private and nationalised industries? Will he make certain that these workers are paid wage increases in this round of negotiations substantially above the 12 per cent. which, it was revealed yesterday, has been the average wage increase over the last 12 months?
§ Mr. Johnson SmithThe offer made to the lower-paid workers in the recent round of wage negotiations works out at 11½ per cent. Average earnings in ROF factories are £23.38 a week. As the hon. Gentleman knows, these matters are still being negotiated.
§ Dame Joan VickersWould my hon. Friend bear in mind that many people on the lower wage rates are getting as little as £13.50? Even at the wage he mentioned, if they have two children, they would get more if they were unemployed, and some actually receive FIS.
§ Mr. Johnson SmithI will certainly see that those words are brought to the attention of my right hon. Friend.
§ Mr. JuddIs the hon. Gentleman aware that this problem goes much wider than the Royal Ordnance factories, for it affects the dockyards, too? Is he aware that there is burning resentment among industrial civil servants in defence establishments about what they see as the paltry sums with which they have to meet the difficulties of inflation? Is he aware that only today a nuclear accident exercise in Portsmouth Dockyard was cancelled because of an industrial dispute which resulted from resentment among the men?
§ Mr. Johnson SmithAs the hon. Gentleman knows, negotiations are continuing.
§ Mr. Evelyn KingIs my hon. Friend aware that at Bovington, for instance, skilled men are doing most responsible work including building Long John armoured fighting vehicles for use in 897 Ulster, but they are apprehensive about the standards at which their wages enable them to live? Is he aware that unskilled men are getting £17 and have no overtime? Is not this an anxious situation?
§ Mr. Johnson SmithI am certainly aware of the valuable work that they are doing. However, as I said, negotiations are taking place, and I cannot add to what I have already said.
§ Mr. LoughlinI appreciate that the hon. Gentleman is in a delicate position while negotiations are taking place. However, in view of what has been said on both sides of the House, and as some labourers have a take-home pay of only £15.35, will he not instruct his negotiating committee to make a substantial increase in the offer already made?
§ Mr. Johnson SmithThis is a question of negotiation for the Civil Service Department. The negotiations are being conducted by the Civil Service Department on behalf of my Ministry. I do not think that there is anything further that I should say. My purpose is to do everything possible to facilitate the negotiations. I do not wish to say more than I have already said.
§ Mr. John MorrisThe Minister cannot shelter behind the Civil Service Department, which may be conducting the negotiations. The question of the efficiency of these establishments is for the hon. Gentleman's Department. Will he give a clear indication to his right hon. Friend that he should ensure that wages throughout these establishments are comparable with those in other industries?
§ Mr. Johnson SmithWe have a continuing interest in these negotiations. As the right hon. Gentleman knows, the Ministry of Defence plays an important part in the Joint Co-ordinating Committee on these negotiations, and I am satisfied that our views are properly taken into account. But it is the Civil Service Department which conducts the negotiations.