Concorde

HC Deb 17 July 1972 vol 841 cc17-20

18. Mr. Barnes

asked the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry how many complaints were received by his Department about the noise made by Concorde 002 when it landed at London Airport on Saturday, 1st July

Mr. Michael Heseltine

Up to Friday, 7th July, 25 complaints were received in the Department. I understand that 522 complaints were received in the Southern Divisional Office of the Civil Aviation Authority and 114 by the British Airports Authority. Over 70 per cent. of those were on cards distributed before the aircraft returned to this country on 1st July by the Anti-Concorde Project. Thirty-two messages of congratulation were received and I believe that nearly all the several thousand visitors to Heathrow did so out of pride in the aircraft.

Mr. Barnes

Is the hon. Gentleman aware, whether or not the protests were organised in the way he alleged, that the fact remains that a large number of people living in West London under the glide path of London Airport, some of whom I have visited and talked to, were scared out of their wits by the noise on that occasion and some were convinced that something was about to crash? Will he reaffirm the answer which his hon. Friend gave to me on 8th May that when Concorde comes into operation the noise it makes will be about the same as that of the 707 and VC10?

Mr. Heseltine

I can confirm that the manufacturers will be entering into contracts that provide for the noise levels of Concorde to be similar to those of the 707, DC8 and VC10 now using international airports. May I take advantage of the hon. Gentleman's Question to make it clear that while I have not the slightest doubt that a large number of letters were organised by the anti-Concorde project, that is by no means all picture. There were undoubtedly a number of people who wrote to me because they realised that this was a noisy aircraft and they wanted me to understand that this was a genuine personal point. They wanted me to read their letters, which I have done. I am fully sympathetic with that view, which I fully understand. I had to take a decision whether to bring Concorde back to Heathrow—realising that this was not the engine which would be used when the aircraft went into service—and thereby enabling a real tribute to be paid, which the overwhelming majority of people wanted to pay, to the people who had made the Concorde tour such a success.

Mr. Benn

We are grateful for what the hon. Gentleman said about the difference between the present engine and the engine that will be in the aircraft on entry to service. Is the hon. Gentleman aware that I hope that he will not give any impression—he did not do so in hisanswer—that the Government are unconscious of the noise problem but that, on the contrary, they realise that even those who organise protests about noise do reflect a body of opinion? Is he further aware that we have a difficult balance to keep here and. if I may say so, that the Government are keeping it well? Does he realise that I hope that in promoting this aircraft, in which a great investment has been made, we shall all be highly conscious of the fact that environmental standards in peoples' minds are rightly and properly rising?

Mr. Heseltine

I am sure that I have a responsibility to ensure that there is a balance between real growth in airport use and environmental considerations. Equally, I have to take into account that certain of the postcards from the anti-Concorde project complaining about noise were posted before the aircraft had reached Heathrow.

19. Mr. Dalyell

asked the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry if he will make a statement about the European Space Conference on llth–12th July, with particular reference to possible British participation in the American post-Apollo programme.

27. Mr. Tebbit

asked the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry what recent discussions he has had concerning United Kingdom participation in the American post-Apollo; and if he will make a statement.

Mr. Michael Heseltine

Member countries of the European Space Conference decided on 6th July that the implications of the revised offer by the United States of participation in the post-Apollo programme required further detailed study. The proposed meeting on 11th–12th July was therefore postponed until September. Discussions with our European partners are currently taking place.

Mr. Dalyell

Has the hon. Gentleman's attention been drawn to a statement in today's issue of Aviation Week which says: In London, officials close to the project tend to agree with Frutkin —that is, Frutkin of NASA— that 'there has been constant procrastination on decision-making at all levels'. This is a reference to the British Government. Have we, as Europeans, said goodbye to participation? How does the Minister explain the sins of his predecessors?

Mr. Heseltine

I must confess that there are certain of my predecessors in some distant Government, not long ago, in fact, whose sins I could never explain in any circumstances. It is true so say that this is a very difficult decision for Europe to make. There are a large number of wide issues involved and Europe rightly wants to give them careful consideration from a political and technological point of view. This we are doing, and the Americans fully under stand our position. That is why they have been able to extend—

Mr. Dalyell

What makes the hon. Member think that?

Mr. Heseltine

The answer to that sedentary question is that the Americans fully understand the situation and that is why they have enabled us to put off the decision, until the autumn, in this way.

Mr. Tebbit

Will my hon. Friend not agree that unless something is done before long to improve decision-making on this sort of project within this country and Europe, the decision on possible participation will be taken by default and we shall still be discussing the project as the Americans launch it into the air?

Mr. Heseltine

This is a problem facing the Government and the European Governments. I hope, on the specific application to which the question draws attention, that we shall not let the decision go by default.

Mr. Millan

What is the new deadline for decision?

Mr. Heseltine

The Americans have talked to us in terms of September-October.