North Sea Oil

HC Deb 12 July 1972 vol 840 cc1547-53

1. Mr. Douglas

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will request his Economic and Industrial Division to evaluate the total possible job gains to Scotland from the exploration, production and servicing of North Sea oil, in the light of the latest discoveries.

31. Mr. Strang

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will commission a report from an independent team of experts on the potential number of jobs which could be created in Scotland during the next five years through the exploitation of North Sea oil.

The Secretary of State for Scotland (Mr. Gordon Campbell)

Such an evaluation could only be very approximate and would soon be out of date, since new discoveries are likely to continue and new schemes are likely to be formulated by those whose exploration proves successful. The important task is to enable the maximum of new jobs to be created in Scotland without delays, for example, by legislation to allow oil rig servicing at Peterhead.

Mr. Douglas

Does not the Secretary of State consider it remarkable that the latest issue of the Scottish Economic Bulletin does not mention North Sea oil? Does this not substantiate to a large degree the criticism made by Sir William McEwan Younger that the Government are not following up this exploitation in the manner in which they should?

Mr. Campbell

As hon. Members will know from my reply to a Question on 4th July, I have caused to be placed in the Library the first two editions of the periodic information sheet on North Sea oil.

Mr. Strang

Is the Secretary of State aware that only yesterday at a meeting in the House the Manager of the BP Forties field was lamenting the fact that even now so few British firms are coming forward to tender for important contracts in this field? These contracts go to not only the Americans but to French, Dutch and Italian firms. Their offshore industries have a better record of Government help. Will the Government look at the way in which they can get involved with Scottish industry and British industry as a whole to develop expertise for this offshore industry?

Mr. Campbell

I have been broadcasting information and drawing attention to all the opportunities for Scottish industry for many months. I was also interested in the announcement by BP that it thought that as many as 40,000 jobs might be created by its plans. I understand that included in this figure was a multiplier of five—that is to say, about one-sixth of the jobs were directly related to BP's plans and the others were indirectly related.

Mr. Sproat

Would my right hon. Friend agree that it is much more important now to get on with practical measures, such as the provisions for Peterhead harbour and the loan and grant for Aberdeen harbour, improvement of infrastructure and the speeding-up of planning procedures, so that Scotland can take the maximum advantage from North Sea oil?

Mr. Campbell

I agree entirely with my hon. Friend. I know that those concerned with North Sea oil exploration expect to meet stormy weather in the North Sea, but I doubt whether they expected to meet the heavy weather that the Bill concerning Peterhead harbour has been meeting in the Scottish Committee.

Mr. Baxter

Has the Secretary of State or any Government Department given consideration to the utilisation of resources such as the natural oil of the North Sea for not only the present generation but future generations, or are we only greedy people looking for our own immediate advantage without planning for the future needs of the people of Scotland?

Mr. Campbell

It is reckoned that oil which is likely to be found below the North Sea, besides that which has already been found, will be available for many years to come. I believe that it is in the Scottish interest that we should encourage the production of oil from these fields as soon as we can.

Mr. Douglas

In Scotland.

Mr. Ross

Bearing in mind that the Bill to which the right hon. Gentleman has referred was completed in less than two sittings and that the Lord Advocate and the Minister in charge thanked us for valuable contributions to it, it is rather surprising that the right hon. Gentleman takes this attitude. Will he say what he or his officers are doing to meet some of the complaints made by my hon. Friend the Member for Edinburgh, East (Mr. Strang) about contact directly with Scottish industries? Surely the Minister of State is the man who should certainly have some influence in this respect.

Mr. Campbell

The Ministers of both the Scottish Office and the Department of Trade and Industry are in touch with those concerned, not only industry, but commerce, and authorities such as NESDA and local authorities which are very much concerned with the protection of amenity as well as with the development of this new industry.

9. Mr. William Hamilton

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what meetings he has arranged to attend over the next six months to discuss the oppor- tunities presented by the North Sea oil discoveries off Scottish shores.

Mr. Gordon Campbell

I am continually discussing these matters with groups and individuals from the bodies and industries concerned, while keeping in close touch with my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry.

Mr. Hamilton

Will the Secretary of State tell us whether he intends to have an urgent meeting with Sir William McEwan Younger in view of the fact that he, as Chairman of the Tory Party in Scotland, has advocated nationalisation of this organisation? If he will not do that, will the right hon. Gentleman at least give an assurance that he will make inquiries to see that no civil servant in his Department has any very close personal relationship with any of the oil companies concerned?

Mr. Campbell

I do not wish to comment on the hon. Member's last remark except to say that it is the dutyof my Regional Development Division to be in the closest touch with the companies involved in this business. The staff of the division have received a tribute from many of the companies for the way they are the contact men with the Government on every kind of problem that arises. I would hope that the hon. Member will appreciate the things that have been done already. Platform building is taking place in at least three places, and the biggest platform in the world is about to be started this month at Nigg Bay. Servicing facilities are available, particularly at Peterhead, and the pipeline to Grange-mouth is now being planned with expansion at Grangemouth.

Mr. Wolrige-Gordon

Is my right hon. Friend aware that while nationalisation is always unintelligent, it would be particularly unintelligent at this stage of oil development in the North Sea?

Mr. Campbell

It would be bound to hold up everything rather than accelerate development. The previous Government, like us, operated on the basis of allocating blocks, going as fast as investment and technology can proceed.

Mr. Donald Stewart

While Scotland may become the Texas of Europe for the extraction of oil, there seems very little prospect that it will become the Texas of Europe when it comes to profits. An increasing number of people in Scotland are determined that on this issue the cake shall not be cut in the customary manner of British Governments—that is, with the profits going to England and the pollution to Scotland.

Mr. Campbell

Except for the refineries this is not a polluting industry. It is a clean industry and most of the operations so far started are non-polluting. I disagree entirely with what the hon. Member has said. The royalties from oil cannot begin for another two years because that is when the first oil will start to flow from Scottish waters. As for Government help, there has been 100 per cent. loan of over £1 million to part of Aberdeen Harbour, a 60 per cent. grant towards the fishing harbour at Peterhead and another £1 million of work Accelerated improvements have been announced for roads in the North-East and there is a great deal more being done which I shall not catalogue now.

Mr. Ross

Sir William McEwan Younger made substantial criticisms. Has Sir William asked for a meeting with the Secretary of State or has the Secretary of State asked for a meeting with Sir William to discuss these matters?

Mr. Campbell

I have seen Sir William twice since he made his speech. Our meetings are routine. I see him from time to time anyway.

20. Mr. Ronald King Murray

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make a statement upon arrangements for long-term economic planning in regard to the impact of North Sea oil upon the Scottish economy.

Mr. Gordon Campbell

The Scottish Economic Council and Planning Board provide appropriate machinery together with the Scottish Standing Conference on North Sea Oil. In addition the Government study into opportunities for industry over the period to 1985 is being carried out.

Mr. Murray

Will the Secretary of State consult his ministerial colleagues and the oil industry on the possibility of setting up a North Sea oil development authority to co-ordinate all aspects of the development of North Sea oil? If such an idea finds favour, will he insist that the authority be sited in Scotland and consider the powerful claim of Leith, sited as it is at the centre of the development, to house such an authority?

Mr. Campbell

I am certainly ready to consider additions and improvements to the existing machinery. There is a planning conference and there are planning authorities already in the field. If they are to go into the planning they will need to be given statutory powers by Parliament. There is great concern among the planning authorities about protecting amenity and also about the fishing industry. None the less, there is no doubt that the oil in the North Sea can create a new and flourishing industry, with ancillary services and many new jobs for Scotland.

Sir J. Gilmour

Does my right hon. Friend agree that oil from the next development off the Scottish coast is likely to come ashore by sea rather than by pipeline? Is he aware of the anxiety in Scotland about whether the oil is to be landed in Scotland or elsewhere?

Mr. Campbell

I amwell aware of the interest, but only two companies have announced their plans. Other companies still have to make up their minds.

Mr. Grimond

The Secretary of State will of course appreciate that such headquarters should be sited either in Orkney or Shetland. While I do not under-estimate the excellent work done by the Scottish Office, the discovery of oil raises entirely new problems. Will the Secretary of State therefore keep in touch with Norway and other countries which are facing these new problems and have some experience on how they are best handled?

Mr. Campbell

We are watching what is done in other countries. The policy we have been following is to try to speed the exploration and then the production of oil as fast as investment and technology will allow. Other countries have not necessarily been following the same policy. I believe that our policy is right for Scotland. If we had gone more slowly we probably should not know today of the discoveries opposite the Scottish shores.

Mr. Ross

One trouble surely is that ministerial responsibility rests not with the Secretary of State for Scotland but with the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry under the Continental Shelf Act and the Petroleum Acts going back to about 1924. Is the right hon. Gentleman satisfied that there is sufficiently close co-ordination between himself and his right hon. Friend? If he is, bearing in mind that the full potential has not yet been realised and its immense importance to Scotland, will not he and the Government consider producing a White Paper giving as much information as possible on the planning aspects and the future?

Mr. Campbell

I think I made it plain in my earlier replies at the cost of some repetition that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry is primarily responsible for the oil industry and also that we work very closely together. Of course I will consider producing more information, but the situation is continually changing. What can be said today is very different from what could have been said six months ago because of developments even since then. As I said earlier, I have arranged to have placed in the Library from time to time for the benefit of hon. Members bulletins containing information about North Sea developments. That may be the best way of dealing with this because the situation is continually changing as more information becomes available.