HC Deb 09 November 1971 vol 825 cc829-31
Mr. Harold Wilson

Further to the points of order which were raised on the Prime Minister's answer to Questions Nos. 4 and 5, Mr. Speaker. I submit to you that there is a point of order for the Chair arising out of the answer. When any Ministers, Prime Ministers or any others, have given a form of answer which has seemed to preclude their being willing to answer similar Questions in the future, it has very often, if not invariably, been the practice that the Table Office has refused to accept Questions on similar lines.

Therefore, Mr. Speaker, it is appropriate to ask whether it will now be the practice of the Table Office, in the light of the Prime Minister's Answer, so to refuse Questions; because that would be a very significant narrowing of the ability of the House to question the Prince Minister. If that is not the position— you may want a day in which to consider this matter, because perhaps you will have to consult the Table Ofice—I suggest, through you, Mr. Speaker, that, in so far as it may have this effect, there should be discussions through the usual channels about what the right hon. Gentleman has said.

Mr. Speaker

I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for the way in which he has put that point of order. The last part of it was certainly a thought that had already occurred to me. However, I will consider the position of the Chair in the matter, and, as the right hon. Gentleman suggests, consult the Table Office and rule accordingly if necessary.

Mr. Thorpe

Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. Will you also bear this point in mind. The Prime Minister chose to answer two Questions together concerning unemployment in Lanarkshire and internment in Northern Ireland, which seemed a rather strange coalition. The right hon. Gentleman professed his wish to do so by the time-hallowed formula of saying, "With permission". It appeared that that was not unanimous. to say the least.

Is that the permission of the Chair? Is it the permission which is assumed of the entire House? Is it the permission which it is thought might be given on a free vote or on a vote where the Whips are on? How can we be guaranteed that Prime Ministers do not, with the best will in the world, assume permission when manifestly the reverse happens to be the case?

Mr. Speaker

I can answer the right hon. Gentleman straight away. It is one of those graceful courtesies to which the House has become accustomed. The right hon. Gentleman does not need the permission of the Chair or of the House. He can decide for himself how he answers Questions.

Mr. John Mendelson

Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. Is it not normally your traditional attitude that, if an hon. Member from the back benches rises to one question and then carries on talking about another subject altogether, you immediately call him to order? Therefore, was it not out of order for the Prime Minister to lump together arbitrarily two very serious subjects in this frivolous manner so that it became impossible to pursue either of them seriously afterwards? Was it not, therefore, for you to call the Prime Minister to order as you would call to order any one of us in similar circumstances?

Mr. Speaker

I am not sure that I would or that I would be allowed to. Anyhow, surely it would be better for the House to leave it in the way the right hon. Gentleman the Leader of the Opposition suggested that it should be left. We will consider the matter. I think that it is a case in which the Chair should consider the position with the Table Office. Perhaps the usual channels should have discussions also.

Mr. George Cunningham

Mr. Speaker, on this serious point may I ask you to bear this consideration in mind also? Is it not a manifest nonsense that, because a Minister has once refused to answer a particular kind of Question, it should become the practice, not only that similar Questions will not be answered, but that they cannot be asked? Is not that wider question one which should be taken into consideration when this matter is examined, if necessary by the Select Committee on Procedure?

Mr. Speaker

I should be delighted to transfer the burden to the Select Committee on Procedure. Meanwhile, flowing from what the right hon. Gentleman the Leader of the Opposition said, this clearly is a matter which must be borne in mind in the consideration of the point which has been raised.