ECONOMIC MEASURES (REPORTS) (Hansard, 1 December 1971)

§ Mr. Roy Jenkins
On a point of order Mr. Speaker. In view of the widespread and continuing confusion about the imminent prospect or otherwise of Government economic measures, may I ask the Leader of the House whether he can assure us that the Chancellor of the Exchequer will make a statement tomorrow afternoon 443 endeavouring to clear up this whole matter?

§ The Lord President of the Council and Leader of the House of Commons (Mr.William Whitelaw)
I do not know whether you wish me to reply to that point of order, Mr.Speaker, or, indeed, whether you consider that it is a point of order.

§ Mr. Speaker
In fact, it is not a point of order. What I would normally say is that no doubt the right hon. Gentleman's point will have been noted.

§ Mr. Harold Wilson
Further to that point of order—[HON. MEMBERS: "It is not a point of order."] Very well, on a new point of order. You will recall, Mr. Speaker, that there are abundant precedents: when the previous Administration were in office and a question of this kind was ruled out of order, a member of the Government would say, "Even so, I do not want to leave it where it is. I will answer it."

§ Mr. Speaker
The Chair is in some difficulty. These are not matters of order. But no doubt the point has been noted.

§ Mr. Roy Jenkins
Surely at the very least the Leader of the House—

§ The Prime Minister (Mr. Edward Heath)
It is not a point of order.

§ Mr. Roy Jenkins
The Prime Minister must not attempt to disguise his extreme nervousness on this issue by shouting. Surely at the very least the Leader of the House can say today whether the Chancellor of the Exchequer, returning from a very important international conference, will make a statement tomorrow.

§ Mr. Speaker
Order. Mr. Rippon.

§ The Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster (Mr. Geoffrey Rippon)
rose—

Hon. Members
Sit down.

§ Mr. Joel Barnett
On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. I can understand the Government's desire not to answer the point of order, but there is a very serious situation in the country where—

§ Mr. Speaker
Order. I cannot detect even the beginning of a point of order here. A question on business is not a 444 point of order. I think that the House has gone as far as it can. The Leader of the House has heard what has been said.

§ Mr. Thorpe
On a point of order. Can you help us, Mr. Speaker? I know that it is very difficult for you to rule on a hypothetical point—

Hon. Members
Sit down.

§ Mr. Heffer
This is not the Reichstag.

§ Mr. Thorpe
I believe that it is in order to address points of order to you, Mr. Speaker, and not to below the Gangway opposite. Will you confirm that, were the Leader of the House to seek to rise and make a statement, that would not be out of order?

§ Mr. Speaker
Certainly that would not be out of order.

§ Mr. Rippon
rose—

Hon. Members
Sit down. We do not want you.

§ Mr. Whitelaw
I have no desire at all —[Interruption.] I wish only to point out, Mr. Speaker, that I rise further to a point of order if you rule that it was one. I think that that is the correct position to take. However, having made that point, I am grateful to the right hon. Member for Birmingham, Stechford (Mr. Roy Jenkins), because he warned me in advance that he intended to raise this matter. [HON. MEMBERS: "Oh."] On the right hon. Gentleman's general point, I have nothing to add to what my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister said yesterday. As the right hon. Gentleman will appreciate, there are good reasons why all Governments are reluctant to make statements commenting on speculative stories. Nevertheless, I shall inform my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer of this exchange.

§ Mr. Roy Jenkins
I, too, am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for responding, even if a little belatedly and relucantly, to a point about which I gave him notice and to which he indicated that he would respond. Wil he bear in mind that a serious issue is arising here? For instance, the editor of investors Chronicle said this morning in a radio interview that these reports came from a very high level. Will the right hon. Gentleman make sure that this matter is 445 cleared up tomorrow—[Interruption.] It is no good right hon. and hon. Gentlemen opposite shouting; there is a difficult, serious and important issue here, and they would do well to listen. Will the right hon. Gentleman assure us that this matter will be cleared up, if it can be, by the Chancellor of the Exchequer tomorrow? Will the right hon. Gentleman also bear in mind and convey to his right hon. Friend that, important and damaging though any premature disclosure may be, what in my view would be still more damaging to the Government's and the country's interest as a whole would be if the Government and the Prime Minister, out of pique, were now to postpone measures which they regarded as necessary and desirable?

§ Sir Harmar Nicholls
rose—

§ Mr. Speaker
Order. May I make a respectful suggestion to the House? Points of order on business are difficult matters for the Chair. In this case, had I been asked permission by the right hon. Member for Birmingham, Stechford (Mr. Roy Jenkins) to ask a Private Notice Question on business, I should have agreed. I think that that would have been the way to do it.