HC Deb 29 October 1970 vol 805 cc394-5
11. Mr. Arthur Lewis

asked the Minister of State for Defence how many other ranks, non-commissioned officers and officers were recently engaged in rubbish clearance in Tower Hamlets; how many hours this took; what vehicles and equipment were used; what was the pay drawn by each of these men for that day and in total; what were their total allowances for food and lodgings; and whether Tower Hamlets will have to pay.

Mr. Ian Gilmour

The numbers involved were two officers, two warrant officers, nine non-commissioned officers, and a total of 31 sappers and guardsmen. They used 21 vehicles of various types. The time taken on the task was approximately 7½ hours. The individuals concerned received their normal pay and allowances; the detailed amounts and the total have not yet been established. No special allowances for food and lodgings were issued.

A charge for the service will be made against the local authority.

Mr. Lewis

Did not these men receive far more—and rightly so—than the council workers who would normally do the job? Is it not wrong that local authorities generally should charge and collect rates from the ratepayers and not use that money on the services for which they are allegedly drawing rates? Will the hon. Gentleman see to it that, if troops are used in the future, they are fully paid for by the councils to the Ministry of Defence and that the councils return to the ratepayers the money which they have been saving since the strikes have been on?

Mr. Gilmour

There is no question of local authorities saving money by the use of troops. They will be charged the full cost of what they would have had to pay otherwise, or, if the extra costs which the Ministry of Defence incurs are greater, they would be charged those costs.

Mr. Scott-Hopkins

Will my hon. Friend pay absolutely no attention to what the hon. Member for West Ham, North (Mr. Arthur Lewis) said, but, on the contrary, will he thank the soldiers concerned for doing a very unpleasant job very well?

Mr. Gilmour

I am grateful to my hon. Friend. I am sure that his feeling is widely shared.