HC Deb 26 January 1970 vol 794 cc976-9
5. Mr. Speed

asked the Minister of Technology if he will give in constant 1963 prices the amount by which he estimates annual investment in manufacturing industry has increased between 1965 and 1969.

Mr. Alan Williams

About £130 million.

Mr. Speed

Is the Minister satisfied that this is sufficient to provide the extra capacity that we need both for exports and for import saving?

Mr. Williams

The hon. Gentleman will be aware—I made the point myself at Question Time last week—that the investment levels currently indicated are at least compatible with, and somewhat ahead of, those comtemplated in "The Task Ahead".

Mr. Ridley

Is the Minister aware that if industrial investment had grown at the rate envisaged in the National Plan of 7 per cent., it would have been £335 million more last year than it actually was? What has happened to planning now?

Mr. Williams

The hon. Gentleman should bear in mind that the figures I gave were of an increase of £130 million over two years. During the last two years flat the party opposite was in office, the figure fell by £300 million.

Mr. Molloy

On the argument of investment allowances versus investment grants, can my hon. Friend comment on the fact that the article in yesterday's Sunday Times not only spoke of the confusion of the Opposition's case, but cast serious doubt on their claim that investment allowances were less costly?

Mr. Williams

Certainly, that would seem to be compatible with the evidence which we have. There would be no real saving to the Treasury from the Opposition's scheme. In view of the enthusiasm displayed by hon. Members opposite for cost-effective analysis of our present scheme, it is remarkable that they never bothered to carry out any analysis of their own. What it comes down to is that they prefer to go back to a system of sub rosa subsidy.

6. Mr. Kenneth Baker

asked the Minister of Technology by how much he estimates that investment in manufacturing industries during 1970 will exceed that in 1969 in actual terms and at constant 1963 prices, respectively.

Mr. Alan Williams

Manufacturers' forecasts given in the latest Investment Intentions Inquiry indicated a rise of about 10 per cent. at constant (1963) prices; information at current prices is not available.

Mr. Baker

Is the Minister entirely satisfied with the overall control of investment in the economy? The Minister of Technology seems to be responsible for manufacturing investment and the President of the Board of Trade for investment in the distributive and service industries. Who in the Government is responsible for overall investment, and what is he doing about it?

Mr. Williams

Of course, the Treasury has overall control of the economy, and within that overall control other Departments take certain sectional areas of control. It has to be divided in some way and this seems to be an appropriate form of division.

9. Sir B. Rhys Williams

asked the Minister of Technology if he will give for the latest available date the percentage of gross national product devoted to investment in manufacturing industries in the United Kingdom compared with the United States of America, Germany and Japan, from information available to him from international sources.

Mr. Alan Williams

Investment in manufacturing and construction industries as a percentage of gross national product at current market prices in 1967 was: United Kingdom 4.0 per cent; United States of America, 3.3 per cent.; and West Germany, 5.8 per cent. The nearest comparable figure for Japan was 9.8 per cent.

Sir B. Rhys Williams

If Japan and Germany are investing at such a much higher rate than we are, how can our manufacturing industry be expected to meet that competition in the 1970s with the equipment of the 1950s and 1960s? What are the Government doing about it?

Mr. Williams

This is a situation which prevailed during the 1950s and the early 1960s, when hon. Members opposite were in office, and they were not very successful in dealing with it. Rather than criticise the upturn which has taken place in the level of investment, they should surely now be welcoming any measure that will close the gap.

Mr. Ridsdale

Is there not a direct relationship between the level of Government expenditure and investment in manufacturing industry, and is not investment at current prices in both Germany and Japan twice what it is in this country? Is not their level of Government expenditure considerably lower?

Mr. Williams

The hon. Member will know that there are divers factors which contribute to the differences between different countries, in particular the stage at which they have arrived in their industrialisation. The hon. Member has taken one variable and has tried to make it the key factor. It certainly is not.

Mr. Dalyell

Is not the hon. Member for Kensington, South (Sir B. Rhys Williams) asking for still more millions of Government money?