HC Deb 26 January 1970 vol 794 cc995-7
23. Mr. Hugh Jenkins

asked the Minister of Technology what action he has taken to prepare the people living in the Scottish Highlands and Islands, Northern Ireland, the Isle of Man, Wales and Devon and Cornwall for the sonic bangs soon to be tested in their areas: and if he will offer compensation for loss of amenity and for noise in addition to that for damage to property and persons.

Mr. Carmichael

Officials have discussed the proposed Concorde test route with the administrative authorities in these areas. Compensation will be paid only for damage caused directly by sonic bangs.

Mr. Jenkins

Is not that entirely unsatisfactory? Does not the French experience suggest that considerable disturbance, other than direct damage, will be caused by sonic bangs? Will not my hon. Friend look into the whole question again?

Mr. Carmichael

There is a later Question about the French experience in this respect. My hon. Friend will agree that to try to evaluate loss of amenities in cash terms is very difficult. Some of the other suggestions made are difficult to quantify.

Mr. Corfield

In view of the importance of this project to the nation, will the hon. Member confirm that it is not unreasonable to ask some people to give up some amenity in the national interest?

Mr. Carmichael

That is one of the very big problems of modern technology—how much are we willing to give up in the furtherance of technology? It is a decision for the nation as a whole.

25. Mr. Hugh Jenkins

asked the Minister of Technology whether he is aware that the French Government has paid £143,000 in claims for damages by sonic bangs and that accidents caused by these bangs have caused the deaths of 13 people; and if he will take these matters into account before proceeding further with the Concorde production programme.

Mr. Carmichael

I understand that the French Government did pay the sum mentioned in compensation for damage caused by sonic bangs. Their investigations, however, did not reveal that any deaths were directly caused by sonic bangs.

Mr. Jenkins

Is not the operative word in my hon. Friend's answer the word "directly"? Were not the deaths caused indirectly? Be that as it may, is it not also the case that part of the misleading publicity to which I have referred, and of which his right hon. Friend has not yet heard—I will send him a copy—describes the sonic bang of the Concorde as a low rumble which will disturb no one? Does he think that is an accurate description?

Mr. Carmichael

I have never heard it described as a low rumble, but I will look forward to reading what my hon. Friend has to send. As for the French experience, there was one fatal accident involving the collapse of a farm building following a sonic bang. It was found afterwards that the building was in a highly unsafe condition and could have collapsed at any moment. The effects of the sonic bang will be carefully assessed during the tests before the Government decide how civil supersonic flying over this country should be regulated.

Mr. Emery

Would the hon. Gentleman take some action to warn people about what they can do to prevent damage—to prevent not just one pane in a greenhouse going, but the lot? Is he aware that nothing has so far been done by the Ministry and that it ought to be done soon?

Mr. Carmichael

The Ministry has been having many discussions, for instance, with ecclesiastical authorities, about our cathedrals. We have discussed the possibilities of damage and of examining these buildings. We have advised that buildings over the test route in an unsafe condition should be attended to.

Mr. Ellis

Would my hon. Friend reject in no uncertain terms the statement put forward by the official Opposition spokesman that somehow, in the national interest, I think it was put, we should expect people 1.0 give up amenity and accept the case that if there is noise and disturbance it will incommode people, but we will have to accept it? Is he aware that many of us have constituents engaged in this vital work and believe that it is a technical problem to do with the aircraft? We have to solve the disadvantageous problems. Would he make that clear?

Mr. Carmichael

There is always a balance to be struck in this. The important thing is that test flying starting during the summer will be carefully observed and evaluated before decisions are made as to civil flying over land.