§ 12 and 13. Mr. Gibson-Wattasked the Secretary of State for Wales (1) what was the total number of new houses completed in Wales for the year 1969, and for the last quarter, for both public and private sectors;
(2) what was the number of houses in both public and private sectors under construction at the end of 1969.
§ Mr. George ThomasIn the public sector 7,998 houses were completed in Wales in 1969, 2,210 of them in the last quarter. The corresponding figures in the private sector are 9,306 and 2,353. At the end of the year there were 8,810 under construction in the public sector and 9,747 under construction in the private sector.
§ Mr. Gibson-WattThe right hon. Gentleman will appreciate that these figures, complicated as they are, are very unsatisfactory and that they show a rundown in house building in Wales since 1964. Can he say what are the main reasons for this disappointing result?
§ Mr. ThomasI have been here a long time, as you know, Mr. Speaker—indeed, I came to this House before you—and it is a long time since I heard anything like that. The hon. Gentleman knows that we are breaking records there. In the last 10 years of office of the party opposite, the average number of houses built in Wales was 13,200. Our average has been 19,000 in five years. The hon. Gentleman will have noticed, I hope with satisfaction, that the figures of houses under construction are very encouraging.
§ Mr. Gibson-WattBut the right hon. Gentleman gives very misleading figures to the House. Does he not realise that at the end of 1964 in Wales there were 21,130 houses under construction? Why have the figures dropped so much?
§ Mr. ThomasIf the hon. Gentleman wants figures he can have some more. In the 13 years when hon. Members opposite were in power—I hope they do not mind my referring again to the 13 wasted years—only in 1964 did they build over 14,000 houses a year.
§ Mr. Roy HughesWill my right hon. Friend take to task all those local authorities, particularly those falling behind, which are now controlled by the party opposite?
§ Mr. ThomasI know that my hon. Friend represents one such area where the housing record last year was pitiful.
§ 14. Mr. Gowerasked the Secretary of State for Wales if he will state the various factors which have led to a reduction in the number of new dwellings built in Wales during the past 12 months; by what proportion current building of new houses differs from production in 1964; and what steps he will take to increase the building of new houses in the future.
§ Mr. George ThomasThe chief factor is that waiting lists have shortened and demand diminished as a result of the very high rate of building achieved in the last 11 five years. 18,969 dwellings were completed in 1964. There are 18,500 houses currently under construction. I will take every possible step within my powers to ensure that an adequate rate of building is maintained in the future: it is necessary to do this both to eliminate local shortages and to help with the clearance of unfit houses which have been with us far too long.
§ Mr. GowerIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that present output is barely above what it was in 1964, whatever he may say? Is he further aware that whatever figures he may give the House today, the deepest anxiety about the position has been expressed by the architectural and building professions?
§ Mr. ThomasWe want to build the maximum number of houses according to the maximum need of the community, and we also seek to give attention to the unfit houses that can be brought into a state of fitness.
§ Mr. Gibson-WattIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that his answer confuses itself? First of all, he says there is no demand. Secondly, he says that there are a great number of unfit houses. Is it not a fact that the figures, however he may look at them, are bad and could be a great deal better?
§ Mr. ThomasThe hon. Gentleman ought to understand that unfit houses need not be pulled down or deserted if they can be put into a proper state of repair. There are many thousands of such houses in Wales that we are determined to restore and provide with modern amenities.
Mr. Fred EvansIs my right hon. Friend aware that there are many authorities in Wales—I could quote some to to him—which are within easy measurable distance of wiping out their housing lists?
§ Mr. ThomasWe all know that there has been a radical change in the waiting lists of local authorities and I welcome what my hon. Friend has said.