HC Deb 10 February 1970 vol 795 cc1049-53
1. Mrs. Reéne Short

asked the Minister of Public Building and Works if he will make a statement about his recent discussions with leaders of the construction industry.

16. Mr. Eyre

asked the Minister of Public Building and Works whether he will make a statement on his meeting with representatives of the building industry and the architectural profession regarding the state of trade in the industry.

31. Mr. Christopher Ward

asked the Minister of Public Building and Works what representations he has received from architects regarding the current level of new commissions for building work; and what replies he has sent.

39. Mr. Heffer

asked the Minister of Public Building and Works what recent discussions he has had with trade unions and employers' bodies and other bodies concerned regarding the high level of unemployment in the construction industry; and what proposals he has to alleviate the situation.

The Minister of Public Building and Works (Mr. John Silkin)

I have had regular discussions with representatives of the industry, and at the meetings held on 22nd January the Chairman of the E.D.C.s for Building and Civil Engineering and the Presidents of the R.I.B.A. and the National Federation of Building Trades Employers gave me their views on the present state of the building industry. I am considering their advice with my colleagues.

Mrs. Short

My right hon. Friend has not given the House any information at all. Is he aware that a large number of hon. Members share the concern of the building industry about the present state of the industry and the fact that the building materials producers are working to only about half their capacity? Is he further aware that by 1974 nearly 80 of the larger municipal corporations will have stopped building? As long ago as 1967 I proposed to his predecessor that a national building corporation should be started. Why has no action been taken on this?

Mr. Silkin

There are a number of questions here. I thought that I had answered the original one. Obviously, the state of the building industry is a matter of concern to the Minister, and that was precisely why I called the representatives of the industry in to see me.

In reply to the other points raised by my hon. Friend, I have on several occasions been asked about a national building corporation or a State building corporation, and I have always said that if any hon. Member is interested in this way of dealing with the situation, perhaps he would make representations.

Mrs. Short

We have.

Mr. Silkin

The hon. Lady may have made representations to my predecessors three or four years ago, but she has never made any to me.

Mrs. Short

Read the Report of the Estimates Committee.

Mr. Eyre

Is the Minister aware that the industry and the profession can no longer be put off by expressions of sympathy, and that they need immediate positive action, such as the removal of selective employment tax and the easing of credit terms, to get them out of what threatens to be the worst depression affecting the industry since the 1930s?

Mr. Silkin

These were among the points made by members of the various professions who saw me, though not by the architects, with whom the hon. Gentleman's Question was concerned. Of course one is aware of the degree of concern in the industry, but the peak of building at this moment throughout the industry is considerably more than it was at the time when hon. Gentlemen opposite were in control of our destiny.

Mr. Christopher Ward

Is the Minister aware that the architects' latest quarterly inquiry showed a record slump in new commissions, which may be reflected in building activities 18 months hence? How many more indications of a slump does he require to jerk him out of his complacency?

Mr. Silkin

I do not think that I have been complacent in this matter because, as I said—perhaps the hon. Gentleman did not hear me—it was I who called the leaders of the industry to see me. The architects, with whom I have great sympathy, put their point of view very clearly. Nevertheless, it is a patchy future for them. In some regions the figures are holding very well; it is mainly the London-based offices which appear to be feeling a drop in commissions at the moment.

Mr. Heffer

Does not my right hon. Friend agree that, with 125,000 building operatives out of work, 5,500 of them on Merseyside alone, this is a most serious crisis in the building industry? One-fifth of our total unemployed are concentrated in the building industry. Does there not need to be drastic action on the part of the Government, and will my right hon. Friend, with whom I sympathise, inform the Treasury that action must be taken, and taken soon, to overcome this serious problem?

Mr. Silkin

I share my hon. Friend's concern about the unemployment figures. This was one of the factors which led me to call the leaders of the industry together. I am considering with my colleagues the very questions he has raised. As far as I am concerned, there is no complacency and no lack of action by me or my colleagues.

Mr. Chichester-Clark

If the Minister is not complacent why did he not act months ago on the requests made continually from this side, and the other side of the House, that he should go to the Chancellor and ask that house builders should be placed in a priority class? Why leave it too late and let the industry die through letting it down?

Mr. Silkin

In the first place, I do not think that this feeling that I have let the industry down is shared by the industry. I have had regular discussions throughout, and it is well aware that all representations made to me have not been exactly kept to myself. I am bound to say that this new concern of hon. Gentlemen opposite—[Interruption.] Yes, new concern. If hon. Gentlemen will listen to me, I am perfectly happy that our record should be judged, especially when it is realised that in our three worst years of house building we built 150,000 more houses than hon. Gentlemen opposite during their three best years in office.

Mr. Spriggs

Is my right hon. Friend aware that St. Helen's Corporation housing department has in the last financial year paid almost £750,000 in interest rates and that in the next financial year the amount will be over £1 million? Will he concern himself with this problem, and take up with his right hon. Friend the question of the cost of borrowing money for housing, because it is far too expensive?

Mr. Silkin

My right hon. Friend is well aware of the fact that interest rates are high in this country and in almost all industrial countries of the world.

Mrs. Renée Short

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. In view of the unsatisfactory nature of that reply, I beg to give notice that I shall seek to raise the matter on the Adjournment at the earliest opportunity.

13. Mr. Costain

asked the Minister of Public Building and Works what representations he has received from the National Federation of Builders and Plumbers Merchants regarding the state of trade in the building industry; and what action he has taken.

Mr. John Silkin

I have received a copy of a memorandum from the Federation, and I am meeting it on 12th February.

Mr. Costain

Will the Minister be frank and admit that this memorandum points out that the building industry is suffering the worst depression since the war? Does he further realise that unless he is prepared to persuade the Chancellor of the Exchequer to remove S.E.T., the industry will not accept that he is trying to help it?

Mr. Silkin

The points made by the federation were similar in content to those made by the builders. I think that we are all aware of those points. There has been no lack of publicity of them.

I have said that I am considering the matter with my colleagues. At the same time, it was only courteous and right that I should ask the federation to come and see me.

Mr. Frank Allaun

I do not think that my right hon. Friend is either cheating or complacent. Whilst the number of completions this year unavoidably will now show a further decrease, may I ask my right hon. Friend whether he is aware that the number of starts in the house building industry could be rapidly increased if he successfully persuaded the Chancellor to get the banks to make priority loans for house building purposes?

Mr. Silkin

This was one of the points that the builders made. It is a matter for my right hon. Friend to consider.