HC Deb 09 December 1970 vol 808 cc414-6
39. Mr. Arthur Lewis

asked the Lord President of the Council whether the review body he is setting up to investigate pensions increases for retired public servants will be asked to examine the pensions of retired public servants who were formerly Members of Parliament; and whether he will request this review body to investigate the possibility of granting Members of Parliament the same conditions for pension rights as civil servants.

Mr. Whitelaw

I announced to the House on 4th December the intention of the Government to refer the whole question of emoluments, allowances, expenses and pensions of Members of the House to one of the Review Bodies announced on 2nd November by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Employment. I think this is the more appropriate course.

Mr. Arthur Lewis

I thank the Lord President for that helpful reply. Will he deal with the last point raised in the Question; namely, tying Members' pensions to Civil Service pensions, which would then automatically take this matter out of the arena of any review or constant investigation?

Mr. Whitelaw

I think that the best course at this time is to say that of course this would naturally be one of the things which the Review Body could perfectly well consider. [Interruption.] Equally, I think that there are, as my hon. Friend the Member for Tynemouth (Dame Irene Ward) seems to be indicating from behind me, several views on this point. Therefore, I believe that it will be right for the Review Body to consider all the circumstances very carefully.

Dame Irene Ward

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that I do not wish to be tied to any civil servant?

Mr. Whitelaw

I would never have imagined that my right hon. Friend would wish to be tied to a civil servant or anybody else.

42. Mr. Arthur Lewis

asked the Lord President of the Council whether he is aware that although Members of Parliament have had no salary increases since October, 1964, Peers have had their expenses allowances increased to £6 10s. per day; and whether, to assist Members who have to pay increased hotel and board and lodging allowance when attending to their parliamentary duties, he will move for the same allowances as are paid to Peers to be paid to Members of the House of Commons.

Mr. Whitelaw

It would be inappropriate to extend to Members of this House the system of expenses allowance which applies to Members of the House of Lords under very different circumstances.

Mr. Arthur Lewis

I rather thought that the non-democratically elected body would get preference over the democratically elected body, although I pay tribute to some of the noble Peers who have voluntarily agreed to postpone their 14 per cent. increase on top of the 37 per cent. which they received in the last two and a half years.

However, is the Minister aware that hon. Members representing country or out-of-London constituencies and who have to live away from their homes must obviously have found that things have become vastly different over the last six years generally, and in the last six months in particular when the £ has depreciated by 6.6 per cent.?

Mr. Whitelaw

I do not wish to follow the hon. Gentleman into his comparisons with another place. I agreed to refer all these matters to a Review Body. I believe that that is the right place for these matters to be considered. I believe that the House as a whole thinks that it is the right place. That is why I did it. I hope that we shall now proceed on that basis. I realise that this means delaying some other matters, but I think that the House accepts this position.

Mr. Raphael Tuck

Does the Leader of the House agree that the expenses incurred because a person is a Member of Parliament should be allowed to him or her?

Mr. Whitelaw

These are all matters appropriate to be considered by the Review Body. I note what the hon. Gentleman says.

Mr. Bob Brown

Whilst the whole House is grateful for the Review Body submission, will the Leader of the House give an undertaking that the Government will accept the Review Body's recommendations and implement them as quickly as possible?

Mr. Whitelaw

No, Sir. I made it quite clear last Friday that I did not think that this or any Government could be bound in advance to the recommendations of a Review Body, and to that answer, which I think is widely appreciated on both sides of the House, I must stick.

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