NORTHERN IRELAND (Hansard, 14 October 1969)

§ Q3. Mr. Molloy
asked the Prime Minister if he will make a statement on the discussions which have taken place recently between himself and the Prime Minister of Northern Ireland; and what plans he has for further discussions.

§ Q9. Mr. Judd
asked the Prime Minister whether he will make a statement on his consultations with the Prime Minister of Northern Ireland.

§ Q10. Mr. Fisher
asked the Prime Minister if he has any statement to make about the situation in Northern Ireland.

§ Q13. Mr. Lubbock
asked the Prime Minister if he will make a statement on the results of his further discussions with the Prime Minister of Northern Ireland.

§ The Prime Minister
On my discussions with the Prime Minister of Northern Ireland on 19th August, I would refer to the Communiqué and Declaration published as Command Paper 4154.
On developments since then, I have nothing to add to what my right hon. 204 Friends the Home Secretary and the Secretary of State for Defence said in the debate yesterday.—[Vol. 788, c. 47–65, 152–64.]

§ Mr. Molloy
Would the Prime Minister not agree that one of the most prominent and dominant features of the present situation is the fact that so many people who have feared social degradation now fear physical violence as well, and that one must put something in place of fear? Would not the recommendations of paragraph 8 of the Communiqué of 29th August and the Hunt Report make a good contribution to this end? Could my right hon. Friend ensure that these recommendations, in consultation with the Prime Minister of Northern Ireland, are speedily implemented?

§ The Prime Minister
The statements of my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary, both in this House yesterday and on his two visits to Northern Ireland, and I think the statements made by many hon. Members yesterday, confirm the basic underlying fact of fear—fear from each side about the other. As to what my hon. Friend calls social degradation, a great deal of progress has been made, both before the recent events in talks with Captain O'Neill and Major Chichester-Clark, and since, in trying to remove some of the economic, social and human rights problems in Northern Ireland.

§ Mr. Fisher
Would the right hon. Gentleman agree that three appeals should now go out to Ulster from this House—for a Catholic response, now that all their grievances have been met, especially to the Hunt Committee's Report, which is the key; for an end to the understandable but very regrettable Protestant backlash in Belfast; and, thirdly, for a rejection of the extremism on both sides which is as horrifying to 90 per cent. of the people in Ulster as it is to all of us in this House?

§ The Prime Minister
While not associating myself with every word which the hon. Gentleman has used in respect of those three appeals, I should have thought that the message which went out from all parts of the House in yesterday's debate underlined those three appeals and underlined in particular what my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary said on these three questions during his visits to Northern Ireland.

§ Mr. Lubbock
In view of the enormous burden of work which has fallen on the shoulders of the Home Secretary, whose efforts in the cause of peace and social justice in Northern Ireland we all applaud, will the Prime Minister consider appointing temporarily a Minister of State at the Home Office who will deal entirely with the affairs of Northern Ireland and take the opportunity of discussing this matter with Major Chichester-Clark at the earliest opportunity?

§ The Prime Minister
I considered this seriously in August at the time when the Prime Minister of Northern Ireland came to London. I can see the arguments for it, but I think the arguments against it are still stronger. In dealing with the Northern Ireland Government on the important problems which we face in common, the meetings should either be at Prime Minister level, as they have been to some extent, or they should be on the basis of visits to Northern Ireland by a very senior member of the Cabinet. I do not think that the Northern Ireland Government or the Northern Ireland communities would feel that a Minister of State, however effective, could really replace those contacts.

§ Mr. McMaster
Can the Prime Minister say what progress has been made in restoring law and order to all parts of Northern Ireland so that citizens, police and army can go wherever they like, and keep the peace, make searches or arrest anyone if and as necessary? Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the present situation is a considerable cause of dissatisfaction?

§ The Prime Minister
I agree with the hon. Gentleman. The problem is to restore law and order. I have nothing to add to what my right hon. Friend said yesterday on all these questions. I am sure that the hon. Member, thinking about the events of the past few months and indeed of the past 50 years, will feel that some of the steps which are now being taken, including the very valuable Hunt Report and its acceptance by the Government of Northern Ireland, will go a long way to ease some of the problems which have lain dormant and have flared up in the past few years.