§ 03. Mr. Biggs-Davisonasked the Prime Minister if he will give details of the communications he has received from Mr. Pat Bashford about the Government's Rhodesia policy; and what reply he has sent.
§ The Prime MinisterI have not received any such communication, Sir.
§ Mr. Biggs-DavisonHas the Prime Minister studied what this leading liberal opponent of Mr. Smith—
§ Mr. ThorpeOh, really!
§ Mr. Biggs-Davison—wrote in The Times: that sanctions are having precisely the opposite of the intended effect? This being so, could he not now make a 1506 reappraisal, however agonising, restore normal trade and allow British ideas to compete again in Rhodesia with those of South Africa?
§ The Prime MinisterI saw the statement reported in The Times, of Mr. Bash-ford and also the replies to it by certain other people, including the Bishop of Matabeleland, whose attitude I would rather follow on Rhodesian questions. So far as British ideas are concerned, I have never noticed the hon. Member very active in seeing that British ideas of human rights are pushed in Rhodesia.
§ Mr. MolloyHow many other nations have identified themselves with and recognised the illegal regime in Rhodesia, which is so often eulogised by some hon. Members opposite?
§ The Prime MinisterNot one, Sir.
§ Mr. ThorpeIn view of the premise of the question of the hon. Member for Chigwell (Mr. Biggs-Davison), will the Prime Minister bear in mind that Mr. Bashford, whom he described as a liberal, is not so, and that most of the leading liberals in South Africa with any political experience are either in detention in their houses without trial or are in prison camps?
§ The Prime MinisterIt is certainly the case that some of those who have expressed liberal ideas there have shown singularly little effectiveness in pushing them in political terms—
§ Mr. Biggs-DavisonIt is your fault.
§ The Prime MinisterIt is the fault of the fact that they are living under a semi-Fascist regime. So far as the others are concerned, it is a fact that large numbers have been imprisoned without trial—that is true both of Europeans and of Africans who are opposed to the oppressive and repressive nature of the regime which the hon. Member for Chigwell (Mr. Biggs-Davison) has supported.
§ Mr. PagetLeaving aside the question of Mr. Bashford's liberality, does my right hon. Friend feel that the continuation of sanctions has the smallest prospect of toppling Mr. Smith or restoring legality in Rhodesia? If the answer be "No", what is the continuing point?
§ The Prime MinisterThe answer is "Yes". Although I have a great respect for my hon. and learned Friend on many issues, I have never agreed with his continued pressure in this House for four years that we should have a sell-out to racialist policies in Rhodesia.