44. Mr. Gresham Cookeasked the Secretary of State for Social Services how much money was obtained by fraud from the Department of Social Security in 1968; at what rate it is estimated frauds are running at present; and what steps are being taken to eliminate fraudulent claims.
§ Mr. CrossmanNo such estimates can be given. All practicable steps are taken to examine claims and to verify the supporting information. Wherever there is suspicion the case is investigated and, if fraud is established, we prosecute in appropriate cases.
Mr. Gresham CookeIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that there is a good deal of public concern about some of these frauds? Does he recall the case of the Irish chef who claimed that he could get £40 a week out of the Ministry and asked for 70 separate cases to be taken into account? Would it not be easier if managers of Social Security branch offices were given permission, without going to head office, to interview some of these people in places other than their homes or the offices?
§ Mr. CrossmanIf I have understood the Question correctly, head office does not need to give leave to the manager, who is perfectly entitled to interview these people anywhere he likes. As to the general impression which the question created, about fraud, I would point out that in 1968 we had 6,500 prosecutions. We have to see this against 22 million claims. It seems to be a fair kind of proportion.
§ Mr. William HamiltonI see that there were a number of Old Etonians on this racket. As I am anxious to get these figures, can my right hon. Friend hold out any hope of obtaining them?
§ Mr. CrossmanWe are expanding the Government's statistical staff, but we have not got a sufficient number to adopt that kind of specialised approach.