§ Q2. Mr. Tilneyasked the Prime Minister whether Her Majesty's Government are now prepared to offer a site in Parliament Square for a statue of the late Sir Winton Churchill thus enabling the formation of a committee to supervise a worldwide appeal to meet the cost of making and erecting a permanent memorial for the public view in the centre of London to this great Parliamentarian.
§ Q9. Sir J. Rodgersasked the Prime Minister if he will now take the necessary steps to erect a statue, at public expense, of the late Prime Minister, Sir Winston Churchill.
§ The Prime MinisterWhen the hon. Member for Liverpool, Wavertree (Mr. Tilney) last raised this on 11th February I said that before going ahead with a proposal for a further statue of the late Sir Winston Churchill we ought to be sure that there was broad support for it, both in the House and among the public generally. Since then the hon. Member has put down an Early Day Motion which has collected 153 signatories, including hon. Members from both sides of the House, but there has so far been very little evidence of broad public support outside the House. If, however, a committee of the kind the hon. Member has in mind is successful in raising funds sufficient to provide for a statue, the Government, for their part, would be happy to make a site available for the statue in Parliament Square.—[Vol. 777, c. 113–6.]
§ Mr. TilneyWhile I welcome the Prime Minister's limited reply, could he say exactly where in Parliament Square the site would be, whether the Government would be one of the sponsors of the appeal, and whether a Minister would sit on the appropriate committee?
§ The Prime MinisterI should like to consider those points. Certainly I should like discussions with the committee which the hon. Gentleman hopes to form for this purpose as to the exact siting. It would be better if the sponsorship were widely representative of this House, and indeed of the country as a whole. I will certainly consider the question of liaison between a Minister and the committee.
§ Sir J. RodgersIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that there has already been a public appeal on behalf of the late Sir Winston Churchill with a view to the foundation of Churchill scholarships? Will he recall that a similar public appeal was made following the death of General Smuts and that subsequently the right hon. Gentleman's predecessor Socialist Prime Minister, the then Mr. Attlee, put up a statue of General Smuts at public expense in Parliament Square? Why should the great services rendered to the country by the late Sir Winston Churchill not get the same treatment as those of General Smuts?
§ The Prime MinisterWe have a tradition in this House that in the case of a great statesman like the late Sir Winston Churchill we as a House wish to honour his memory within the Palace of Westminster. While I strongly endorse many of the hon. Gentleman's points, if it is thought that there should be a more public statue in the open, we are prepared to go along with it. But the more that it carries with it public confidence and support—I am not in any doubt that it can be found if the committee is energetic—we shall give all the help that we can.
§ Mr. Alexander W. LyonCan my right hon. Friend say why there are four statues to 20th century Prime Ministers in the Members' Lobby but not one Labour Prime Minister?
§ The Prime MinisterI think that that is another question. It will be understood that under the 10-year rule which 638 is normally applied the commemoration of Lord Attlee's undoubted—[AN HON. MEMBER: "Ramsay MacDonald?"] He got corrupted by the party opposite. Lord Attlee's undoubted public service will become a matter for due consideration 10 years after his death.
§ Mr. ThorpeIs it not self-evident from the tributes and the reaction of the nation at the time of Sir Winston Churchill's death that the erection of a statue to him would be widely welcomed by the people? Is it not a fact that there is already cast a statue of Sir Winston Churchill, the dimensions of which are such that it is causing problems in the Members' Lobby, and the suggestion has been made that the statue of another distinguished Prime Minister should be moved in consequence? Would it not be better, therefore, for that statue to be put in the Square?
§ The Prime MinisterAll these matters need to be considered, and the Government will give all the help they can. I believe that a public statue outside, for which there could be great public support, is a matter for the committee which the hon. Member for Wavertree has shown so much energy in organising over a period of months.
§ Mr. ShinwellWill my right hon. Friend pay not the slightest attention to the Leader of the Liberal Party? The statue to be erected in memory of the late Sir Winston Churchill is now being cast in bronze. I speak on behalf of the committee, and I believe that the Minister of Public Building and Works will support me when I say that we are hoping that it will be unveiled by Lady Churchill before the end of this year.
§ Mr. Thorperose—
§ The Prime MinisterClearly my right hon. Friend, who is concerned with these matters, speaks with great authority. Obviously this is a matter on which the Government, through my right hon. Friend, will want to keep in the closest touch with the committee.
§ Mr. ThorpeIn that case, does the Prime Minister not agree that it is unfortunate that the right hon. Member for Easington (Mr. Shinwell) should have written letters to the descendants of that former Prime Minister whose statue 639 already is in the Members' Lobby asking them whether they would mind it being moved?
§ The Prime MinisterThese questions relate to a tribute to a very distinguished statesman and Member of this House. It is not in the best interests of the House or the memory of the statesman concerned to get into rather disappointing exchanges between the right hon. Gentleman and other right hon. Members. We are trying to do a job in commemoration. The Government will be in the closest touch with the committee. The question relates to a statue in Parliament Square. We shall do what we can to help when the hon. Member for Wavertree has been able, as I am sure he can, to mobilise the necessary support.