HC Deb 02 December 1968 vol 774 cc1017-20
20. Mr. Hordern

asked the Secretary of State for Social Services if he will now make a further statement on the practice of Scientology.

Mr. Crossman

After careful consideration, I have decided that the right course is to leave things as they are, at any rate for the present. The specific measures announced by my predecessor were directed at limiting the number of foreign nationals studying and practising scientology here; I consider that these are justified on the basis of existing information. No further measures are contemplated.

Mr. Hordern

Is the Minister aware that that is about as unsatisfactory an answer as could be made by the Government? The Government have sufficient information, one supposes, to justify the actions which they have already taken. Should not this information be made public, so that at least the Press and other people can make free comment upon what the Ministry already knows?

Mr. Crossman

I considered the possibility or desirability of two courses of action. One was a public inquiry and the other a White Paper. I have not excluded the possibility of a public inquiry, but I would like to reflect further on these matters. I think it would be an abuse of our tradition to publish a White Paper until after the inquiry had taken place.

Mr. Arthur Davidson

Is my hon. Friend aware that in reply to a question on the last occasion he quite rightly described Scientology as a fraud? Is it not right, if it is a fraud, that the Press and others should be able to say so outside the House, and could he not set up an inquiry to make this possible?

Mr. Crossman

I agree with my hon. Friend. There are strong reasons for an inquiry along those lines. I think that the Press is free to print the truth about Scientology, and I have no doubt that, in this sense, my hon. Friend's action last July has resulted in a great deal of the truth being published with favourable effects on the behaviour of the Scientologists, who have withdrawn one or two of their more contentious claims, but I should rather leave things as they are at the moment.

Mr. G. Johnson Smith

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that there are a number of citizens, some of them councillors, in East Grinstead who can be inhibited from making what I regard as perfectly fair and proper comment in pursuit of their public duties because of the inaction of the Government, or, if not because of that, at least because, under prevailing conditions, they feel, as a result of libel writs issued on them, that they must pursue a policy of silence, and the right hon. Gentleman's statement has hardly been helpful to them.

Mr. Crossman

I would not agree wholly with the hon. Gentleman, because it is my impression that a great deal of valuable investigation has taken place by the Press and a great deal of interesting information has been published, despite threats of libel action, which have not materialised. I think that the Press is to be congratulated on the thorough investigation it is doing on this activity.

Lord Balniel

I regret that I find the right hon. Gentleman's answer unsatisfactory. Does not he feel that it would be better to have an impartial objective inquiry rather than taking Executive action based on evidence of which some of us are aware, but of which the public are not aware?

Mr. Crossman

As I said on the last occasion when I answered Questions on this matter, I think that this is a very evenly balanced issue. There are arguments in favour of a public inquiry, but, for the moment, I should like to let the matter run because, on the whole, we are getting a lot of information published, and I think that what I described last time as fraudulent practices are, to some extent, being curbed.

Mr. Lubbock

Can the right hon. Gentleman say in how many cases proceedings have been taken against Scientologists for offences against our laws? If the right hon. Gentleman's complaint against Scientologists and the action taken by his predecessor was taken solely on the ground that they were socially undesirable activities, is not that a dangerous precedent to set in the sense that it might be applied to many other religions?

Mr. Crossman

I think that the action taken was justified on the basis of the information that we had. The action did not take the form of prosecution, but merely forbidding foreign nationals to study and practise Scientology here. That seemed a legitimate course of action, but I do not propose to take any further measures.