HC Deb 09 April 1968 vol 762 cc1111-8

(1) Without prejudice to the generality of section 6(2) of this Act, where a country park comprises any waterway the kinds of open-air recreation for which the local authority may provide facilities and services under that subsection shall include sailing, boating, bathing and fishing.

(2) If a country park is bounded by the sea, or by any waterway which is not part of the sea, the local authority providing the country park shall have power to carry out such work and do such other things as may appear to them necessary or expedient for facilitating the use of the waters so adjoining the country park by the public for sailing, boating, bathing and fishing and other forms of recreation.

(3) The powers conferred by subsections (1) and (2) above include power to erect buildings or carry out works on land adjoining the sea or other waters but outside the country park, and to construct jetties or other works wholly or partly in the sea or other waters.

(4) The local authority, before acting under the foregoing provisions of this section, shall consult with such other authorities, being authorities which under any enactment have functions relating to the sea or other waters in question, as the Minister may either generally or in any particular case direct, and Schedule 1 to this Act shall have effect as respects any objection made by authorities so consulted.

(5) A local authority may make byelaws regulating the use of works carried out by them pursuant to this section and of any facilities or services provided in connection with the works, but before making any such byelaws the local authority shall consult the Commission:

Provided that byelaws made under this subsection shall not interfere with the exercise of any functions relating to the waters or land to which the byelaws apply which are exercisable by any authority under any enactment.

Section 106 of the Act of 1949 (supplementary provisions as to byelaws) shall have effect as if byelaws under this subsection were bye-laws under that Act.

(6) Nothing in this section shall authorise the carrying out of any operation in contravention of section 34 of the Coast Protection Act 1949 (works detrimental to navigation).—[Mrs. White.]

Brought up, and read the First time.

Mrs. White

I beg to move, That the Clause be read a Second time.

Mr. Deputy Speaker

With this Clause, we can discuss also Government Amendments Nos. 11, 12, 13, 17, 19, 20, 23 and 83.

Mrs. White

This new Clause really arises out of a discussion which we had in Committee—columns 387–9 on 18th January—in which the hon. Lady the Member for Plymouth, Devonport (Dame Joan Vickers) very rightly pointed out what appeared to be a discrepancy in the Bill. As I freely admitted at the Committee stage, she had put her finger on an anomaly which indeed occurred, and we have taken this opportunity not merely to correct that anomaly but also to do some tidying up in the general arrangement of the Bill, so that we now have included in this one new Clause the various references to the matter concerned. It seemed to us that this would be more convenient for everybody in the future, and I hope very much that it will be acceptable to the House.

The main purpose of the new Clause and the consequential Amendments is to empower local authorities, when creating country parks on the coast or on the banks of waterways, to provide facilities for waterborne recreation on the sea or on the waterways bounding these country parks. When we first discussed this, the hon. Lady pointed out that we had not taken into account the position in which a local authority might be proposing to provide a country park which abutted on to the sea. This new Clause makes this possible and also takes in the other conceivable situation in which there would be a fresh waterway on the edge of a country park and not contained actually within it. I am sure that this is entirely in keeping with the desires of those of us who are concerned with this Bill.

There might be some query as to why it was necessary to put in subsection (3), so I should perhaps just explain this. The reason for this is that one might have a situation in which the country park was separated, for example, from the foreshore, if it abutted on to the sea, by a public highway. It seems to make sense in such circumstances not to attempt to take the highway into the country park but to enable the local authority concerned to establish facilities on the foreshore, thus meeting the purposes of the Clause. That is why subsection (3) is included.

The other consequential Amendments are primarily a tidying up process to bring into the Clause matters formerly contained in Clause 6. We have made a saving for works which might be in contravention of Section 34 of the Coast Protection Act, 1949—that is, works detrimental to navigation. It will be clear why this was necessary. We have also provided that byelaws made under this subsection will have the same effect as any made under Section 106 of the 1949 Act. There is provision in the Schedule for appeals to be made to the Minister if there should be any disputes between the local authority wishing to establish a country park and any other statutory body with an interest. In the Clause and the consequential Amendments we have not only carried out the undertaking given to the hon. Lady but have also improved the drafting and general layout of this portion of the Bill.

Mr. H. P. G. Channon (Southend, West)

The whole House is indebted to the Minister of State for tabling the Clause. It is also indebted to my learned Friend the Member for Plymouth, Devon-port (Dame Joan Vickers) for raising this issue in Committee. The only point I wish to raise is one which has been brought to my attention by my hon. Friend the Member for Haltemprice (Mr. Wall) and by the Yacht and Motor Boat Association, which is a little worried lest there is some intention of using the byelaw powers contained in subsection (5) to impose rigid byelaws and a system of registration for yachts and motor boats. I do not imagine that that is the Government's intention, at any rate for yachts. It would be helpful if the hon. Lady could confirm that no such byelaw powers would empower local authorities to do this sort of thing under the Clause. Subject to that, I am sure that the Clause will be generally acceptable.

Mr. John Pardoe (Cornwall, North)

welcome the Clause and its recognition of the importance of water as a means of recreation. I congratulate the hon. Lady the Member for Plymouth, Devon-port (Dame Joan Vickers) on having raised this matter in Committee. The Clause is of immense importance to the West Country, particularly Cornwall which is almost entirely surrounded by water—not quite, unfortunately.

One or two questions arise on the Clause. It is of great importance to the small boat building industry. Will the financial powers under Clause 26 as related to this new Clause apply to the creation of dams to create boating lakes—not inland boating lakes, but boating lakes which are part of estuaries running into the sea? I am thinking particularly of creeks that need to be dammed to provide an adequate level of water for boating. The North Cornwall coast suffers from heavy tides and normal boating in the open sea is not easy. It is of great importance to us that we should be able from time to time to dam up the odd creek, and even some river estuaries, to provide such facilities.

5.15 p.m.

Where fishing is both an industry and a recreation, how, under the Clause, will it be possible to separate the two? I am thinking particularly of lobster and shark fishing which are an industry but which, during the summer season, are also a leisure-time facility. For instance, would the sheds that fishermen use for storing their pots, and which are part of recreational facilities for tourists, be eligible for this kind of assistance?

What would happen in the case of beaches which are held by the local authority or by the National Trust, to be dangerous because of falling rocks and which are at present sealed off from the public? Would means of access become eligible for grants? Would it be possible for financial help to be given, to open up such beaches completely? I am thinking again of a local spot, a place called Bedruthan Steps which is owned by the National Trust. It is one of the largest areas of sand anywhere in the United Kingdom and probably in Europe. Unfortunately, because of the crumbling rocks, the steps have fallen away and the National Trust has seen fit to exercise its authority to seal off the whole area. I have raised this matter with the National Trust, which has told me that it has a responsibility to shield the public from falling rocks and that this is why it does not wish to renew the access. How far does the Minister of State think that local authorities have a moral duty to save us from ourselves? Should not we be allowed to walk on beaches, in spite of the danger of falling rocks, provided that some warning is given?

I come now to the forms of recreational facilities which are specifically laid out in the Clause. Is water ski-ing included as one of these? Does it come under bathing or boating, or has it been omitted? Are surfing and malibou boarding included in this open air recreation? I am sorry to be a little parochial, but this is of immense importance to the whole of the north Cornish area and I should like to know whether it is included.

My final question relates to the bathing facilities. Presumably oily and dirty beaches mitigate against good bathing facilities. Would the cleaning of beaches be eligible for grant under Clause 26 in relation to this new Clause?

Dame Joan Vickers (Plymouth, Devonport)

I thank the hon. Lady for the trouble she has taken about my Amendment. Little did I think that the small Amendment I tabled would grow to such a magnificent size and cover so many important points. What the Minister of State has done will be a great asset to people in country parks. It will prove to be of benefit particularly to coastal areas.

Mr. Peter Mills (Torrington)

I welcome the Clause, and particularly subsection (2) under which authorities will have power to carry out such works as they regard as necessary for facilitating the use of the waters… and so on. Although they form a great holiday area, North Cornwall and North Devon suffer from a lack of easy boating facilities because of problems created by the tide and the exposed coast. Many visitors come to the area, but I am sure that we lose a good many because we have not the facilities for boating which so many people want nowadays. People who enjoy sailing and boating will usually go to South Devon, where the facilities are easier, rather than to North Devon.

I welcome the Clause, therefore, because local authorities will have a chance to remedy this situation. I should like to see the whole of the North Devon and North Cornwall coast made into an area where sailing and fishing could readily be enjoyed. This may well be possible under the Clause. As the hon. Member for Cornwall, North (Mr. Pardoe) said, there are certain areas where a dam might be put down to provide boating facilities. An excellent inland lake could be made on the Torridge in my constituency, which would be of tremendous benefit to the area and meet the need of the modern generation of people who enjoy sailing.

Another matter of interest to me, on which the Clause may be of value, is that in the South-West there has been opposition to the building of reservoirs. If it is possible for reservoirs to be used for recreation as well, some of the opposition, which is very real, might be overcome. Reservoirs could be opened up for fishing and, perhaps, even for boating.

I hope that the local authorities will use the powers under the Clause and take steps to introduce some of the facilities which the hon. Member for Cornwall, North and I have mentioned. In passing—the hon. Gentleman will not like my saying this—I have in mind that the Clause may help where there is the possibility of a reservoir being demolished or done away with. If the dam is taken away, all the enjoyment which people have experienced, as I have—

Mr. Pardoe

I assure the hon. Gentleman that I am about to use my influence to ensure that he will be able to fish in the Tamar Lake for ever and anon.

Mr. Mills

I am glad to hear that. I was thinking of that lake in the hon. Gentleman's constituency. It seemed that it was to be done away with, which would be a sad event. Perhaps the local authority will be able to stop any such move after the new Clause has come into effect. I and many others have enjoyed the pleasures which the reservoir has given over many years, and I now hope that that little problem will be cleared up. I welcome the Clause, which should be of great benefit in a good many areas, particularly areas such as mine.

Mrs. White

I am delighted that the Clause has had a warm welcome and that our good intentions are appreciated.

The hon. Gentleman the Member for Southend, West (Mr. Channon) raised the question of byelaws. The local authority is under an obligation to consult the Commission, and I am sure that the interests to which he referred will be borne very much in mind in the formulation of any possible byelaws. No suggestion has reached me that the interests to which he referred will be in any way adversely affected by the sort of bye-laws possible here.

I emphasise that the Clause refers only to country parks. I suspect that some hon. Members who have not had the advantage of reading our proceedings in Committee do not entirely appreciate that these powers will be brought into effect only where a local authority has decided to establish a country park. In the beautiful parts of the country represented by the hon. Members for Cornwall, North (Mr. Pardoe) and for Torrington (Mr. Peter Mills), I am sure that various local authorities may well wish to establish country parks. The Clause relates only to such areas.

Mr. Peter Mills

Surely, it would cover land held by the National Trust—vast areas of land?

Mrs. White

Not necessarily. Indeed, probably not. There is a new provision in the Bill under which a local authority may seek to establish a country park not necessarily in its own area. Such a park could be established, with the proper consent and consultation, in the area of another local authority. These powers are to extend the possibilities for country parks and for them only.

Mr. Channon

I am grateful to the right hon. Lady for her answer to the point which I raised. I am sure that the people concerned will be grateful. If some worry still remains, perhaps she will be good enough to look at any representations made to her on the matter.

Mrs. White

Certainly. If I find that there is more in it than I have indicated so far, I shall write to the hon. Gentleman and let him know.

I shall be happy to write to the hon. Member for Cornwall, North on some of the detailed points which he raised, again always within the context of country parks. Had the hon. Gentleman given a little notice of some of the detailed matters, including lobster and shark fishing, one might have been in a better position to reply. It is largely a question of circumstances. A country park will be for recreation, not to promote commercial fishing. Therefore, anything provided must come within the ambit of amenity or recreation. The question of access to beaches and so on will depend upon the area concerned being included in a country park, and also on financial priorities. There will not be endless money for all the things one would like to do, and in setting up a country park the local authority will have to decide how best to spend its money in the general interest. Where a fine beach was otherwise not fully usable, it might be thought that the provision of access was one of the best things to do. But, plainly, this would have to be a matter for careful consideration in relation to the financial priorities.

The list of proposed recreational activities in the Clause is not intended to be final. It makes clear that the recreations provided for shall include sailing, boating, bathing and fishing, but subsection (2) refers also to "other forms of recreation", which could, where suitable and desirable, include water skiing, for example. We had various suggestions made in Committee—kiting behind boats, hovercraft and all kinds of esoteric recreations. These will be matters for consideration by the promoting authority.

Question put and agreed to.

Clause read a Second time and added to the Bill.