Widows (Hansard, 25 July 1966)

§ 42. Mr. Winnick
asked the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance if she will change the regulation which obliges those widows who receive the 30s. allowance to pay 11s. 7d. National Insurance contributions weekly if they are not employed so as to reduce the insurance contribution.

§ The Joint Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Pensions and National Insurance (Mr. Norman Pentland)
No, Sir. The 30s. widow's basic pension is a reserved and transitional right from the pre-1948 insurance schemes, and my right hon. Friend does not consider that its receipt should affect National Insurance contribution liability.

§ Mr. Winnick
Is it not time seriously to consider easing the burden on so many widows, especially those on very limited incomes? Could some guarantee be given that a repayment will take place within a short period of time?

§ Mr. Pentland
No. The widow receiving the 30s. pension does so in circumstances where her counterpart with no reserved rights at all from the old scheme does not. In other words, she is, in effect better off than the no-shilling widow, because she has the advantage of reserved and transitional rights. My hon. Friend may like to know that it is possible for the non-employed 30s. widow with very small means to obtain exemption from the liability to pay the contributions in question.

§ 46. Mr. Gwilym Roberts
asked the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance if she will introduce legislation to give a 13 weeks' widow's allowance to widows who do not qualify under Section 26(1,b) of the National Insurance Act, 1965.

§ Mr. Pentland
No, Sir. I do not think it would be appropriate to pay a benefit intended to assist a widow in adjusting herself to the cessation of her husband's 1208 earnings where that adjustment had already been made on retirement.

§ Mr. Roberts
Is the Minister aware that there is very strong feeling on this side of the House that it is high time we got rid of some of the anomalies in the pension structure so that we have a system tied to the concept of need rather than merely to contributions?

§ Mr. Pentland
Tied to a concept of need is what this provision actually is. I assure my hon. Friend that it may well be that the detailed rules limiting the payment of widows' allowance will eventually need to be revised in the light of the review we are now undertaking, when it comes to make new arrangements for widows' pensions and retirement pensions.

§ 47. Mr. Gwilym Roberts
asked the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance if she will introduce leglislation to remove the anomaly whereby the husband's contributions between the age of 65 and 70 years prior to 25th December, 1961, do not add to his widow's pension.

§ Mr. Pentland
No, Sir. The present arrangements are based on recommendations made by the National Insurance Advisory Committee after an exhaustive examination of increments for wives and widows, and my right hon. Friend does not think there is any case for changing them.

§ Mr. Roberts
Does not the Minister feel, however, that this rather shabby treatment of these widows will act as a disincentive to men now between 65 and 70 to go on working and that this, therefore, will impair the national effort?

§ Mr. Pentland
So far that has not been our experience. I am aware, of course, of the case which my hon. Friend took up with the local office manager in his constituency. The reply he received on that occasion was quite straightforward. It is quite correct that changes in increments are not made restropective. That was the point at issue in my hon. Friend's Question. As I have said, my right hon. Friend can see no reason to change the position.