HC Deb 11 July 1966 vol 731 cc946-8
8. Mr. Hordern

asked the Minister of Labour what discussions he has held with employers and unions following the publication of the National Board for Prices and Incomes Report on Pay and Conditions of Busmen.

19. Mr. St. John-Stevas

asked the Minister of Labour whether he will make a statement on his recent talks with officials of the Transport and General Workers' Union and the Federation of Municipal Passenger Transport Employers on the pay of provincial busmen.

Mrs. Shirley Williams

My right hon. Friend has had meetings with representatives of both sides of the two joint councils which represent the municipal undertakings and the company buses and commended the Report of the National Board for their consideration. I am circulating in the OFFICIAL REPORT the statements issued after each meeting. I am having a further meeting with representatives of the National Joint Council for the Omnibus Industry which represents the company buses on 13th July.

Mr. Hordern

Will the hon. Lady give an assurance that if the pay increase of 6.6 per cent. envisaged in the Report is granted she will ensure that the productivity improvements which also were stated in the Report are obtained?

Mrs. Williams

I cannot give the hon. Member that assurance at this stage because, as he will know, negotiations are still continuing. I would, however, like to point out to him that my right hon. Friend the Minister of Transport has in hand the national programme for improving productivity, which was suggested by the Report of the National Board for Prices and Incomes.

9. Mr. Webster

asked the Minister of Labour what assurances he received from the Transport and General Workers' Union that they would implement the recommendations of the National Board for Prices and Incomes Report on Pay and Conditions of Busmen.

Mrs. Shirley Williams

In his meetings with representatives of both sides of the national joint councils which cover municipal and company operations, my right hon. Friend received assurances that consideration would be given to the Board's Report, which he commended to them, during the current negotiations.

Mr. Webster

Is the hon. Lady aware that assurances were also given that the Phelps Brown recommendations would be implemented, but that very little has been done? Is she convinced that anything will be done to implement paragraph 120 of the Report of the Prices and Incomes Board? If not, what steps will be taken to make sure that this is carried out?

Mrs. Williams

At the moment that is a hypothetical question. I would, however, point to a number of other industries in which trade unions and employers are fully co-operating to try to improve efficiency in those industries.

16. Mr. Alison

asked the Minister of Labour what is the estimated number of municipal and company undertakings, excluding London Transport, who negotiate pay and conditions for busmen.

Mrs. Shirley Williams

In the municipal sector, 92 of the 95 municipal undertakings are parties to the agreements of the National Joint Industrial Council for the Passenger Transport Industry.

In the company-owned sector of the industry, many of the smaller operators are not parties to any central negotia- tions. Some 72 companies, largely representative of the larger employers and collectively operating more than half of the company-owned buses, are parties to the agreements negotiated within the National Council for the Omnibus Industry.

Mr. Alison

I thank the Parliamentary Secretary for that answer, but can she say how many of the firms she has listed, in both the municipal and the company sectors, have, since the publication of Report 16 by the Prices and Incomes Board on bus wages, reached a settlement in excess of the increase of 3–3½ per cent. recommended in the Report, and how many have reached a settlement lower than that percentage? If the hon. Lady does not have that information, what steps is she taking to secure it, and will it be published when available?

Mrs. Williams

If the hon. Member will put a Question on the Order Paper, I will give him that information. I am afraid that I do not have it at present. Three municipalities are not tied by the agreement—Birmingham, Reading and Rochdale.

17. Mr. Alison

asked the Minister of Labour by what means he is informed of the various improvements in manpower use referred to in paragraph 120 of the National Board for Prices and Incomes Report on Pay and Conditions of Busmen.

Mrs. Shirley Williams

Through the national joint councils concerned, with whom we are in close touch.

Mr. Alison

Is the Parliamentary Secretary satisfied that the enormous number of variations and permutations of what is called in the Report of the Prices and Incomes Board "improving the use of manpower" can be built into a coherent and systematic measure of improved productivity which can be fairly applied in the sweeping way recommended for wage settlements in the Report?

Mrs. Williams

The National Board for Prices and Incomes Report suggested that these should be handled partly locally and that we should be kept in touch through national joint councils. I think that we should give an opportunity for that recommendation to work in that field.