§ Mr. SpeakerThe hon. Member for Eastbourne (Sir Charles Taylor) wishes to raise a point with me.
§ Sir Charles TaylorI am grateful to you, Mr. Speaker, for allowing me to raise this matter of procedure.
Under Standing Order No. 5(1), dealing with the Arrangement of Public Business, we read:
Save as provided in this order, government business shall have precedence at every sitting.But in Standing Order 5(4) we read:The ballot for private members' bills shall be held on the second Thursday on which the House shall sit during the session under arrangements to be made by Mr. Speaker, and the bills shall be presented at the commencement of public business on the fifth Wednesday on which the House shall sit during the session.364 It has been customary in the past to place a notice in the Lobbies informing hon. Members that a Ballot is to take place on Private Members' Bills, and two days prior to the Ballot taking place a book is placed in the "No" Lobby so that hon. Members may participate in the Ballot when it takes place.It may be that the House will decide otherwise on this occasion, but should the desires of the Government be thwarted on this occasion I submit that the customary procedure should continue and that the book should be placed in the "No" Lobby for hon. Members to write their names in it and that a notice should be displayed saying that there will be a Ballot for Private Members' Bills under the Standing Order.
Perhaps it would be wrong for me to express an opinion on this occasion, but I hope that the Government's intentions are thwarted and that private Members will retain that long-prized privilege.
§ Mr. SpeakerI am grateful to the hon. Member, as I am to any hon. Member who raises issues which seek to preserve either the orders or the customs of the House. I was not aware of the point raised by the hon. Member until a few minutes ago, but I am now advised by the Clerk and I will deal with it.
It is certainly true that Standing Order No. 5 provides that the Ballot for Private Members' Bills shall be held on the second Thursday on which the House sits in session. On the two days preceding the day of the Ballot a list is, by practice, or custom, placed in the "No" Division Lobby and is available there until the rising of the House each day for Members to enter their names. The hon. Member for Eastbourne is perfectly right in saying this.
Today, however, I am told that the Government have handed in a notice of Motion inviting the House to take steps which may vary the operation of Standing Order No. 5. On that account, as it appeared to them that the House might decide to give other directions before the Ballot was held, the Officers of the House did not proceed with the usual anticipatory notices because to have done so might have proved in the event to have been in conflict with a direction of the House, 365 and, therefore, to have been misleading to hon. Members.
The sole point of the notices in the past has been to assist hon. Members and in pursuance of that duty the Officers of the House have not posted any notices today. I am satisfied that they have acted correctly. The issue itself will have to be raised in some other way.
§ Sir Charles TaylorThank you very much, Mr. Speaker, for your Ruling. I am assuming that the Motion tabled by the Government may be defeated, in which case we shall not have very much opportunity to enter our names in the Ballot book unless the Ballot book is placed in the "No" Lobby tomorrow. I must apologise for not having given you more notice about this, but I was not aware until I came to the House this morning that the Government intended to alter this procedure.
§ Mr. SpeakerIf the hon. Member reads carefully the Ruling which I have just made, he will find that it accepts the basis of his argument but comes to a different conclusion about the detail of the posting of notices.
The other issue—whether the Government shall be thwarted or not—is a matter in which Mr. Speaker is not interested at all, but is a matter for the House.