HC Deb 11 March 1965 vol 708 cc605-6
15. Mr. Park

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science when he proposes to establish an educational trust to advise on the integration of public schools into the State system of education; and with what terms of reference it will be provided.

Mr. Crosland

I hope to make a statement on this matter in due course.

Mr. Park

May I express the hope that my right hon. Friend will make this statement in the near future, because the work of integration is certain to take some time and the sooner it can be started the better? May I also express the hope that my right hon. Friend, in the terms of reference he will provide for the educational trust, will lay down that integration involves the complete abolition of fee-paying and involves also the public ownership of the land and all the assets and buildings of the public schools concerned?

Mr. Crosland

I take note of those points without necessarily going the whole way with my hon. Friend.

Mr. Chataway

Is the Minister aware how misleading were the figures for pupil-teacher ratios in the maintained schools and public schools which he gave in his speech last Saturday? Is he aware that, once allowance has been made for the numbers in the sixth forms and the different age ranges in the schools, the comparison between the staffing ratios in public schools and maintained schools—grammar schools—is nothing like so striking as Mr. Dancy has shown in his book?

Mr. Crosland

Like the hon. Member, I have read Mr. Dancy's book. These figures are not misleading. There is an enormous contrast in teacher ratios between these schools and the State system. It is partly because of this enormous contrast that we say with total justification that the public schools represent a highly privileged section of education in the country.