AGRICULTURE (SILO SUBSIDIES) (Hansard, 14 June 1965)

§ The Joint Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Mr. James Hoy)
I beg to move, That the Silo Subsidies (England and Wales and Northern Ireland) Scheme 1965, a draft of which was laid before this House on 13th May, be approved. I suggest that it might be for the general convenience if we also took the Scottish Scheme, which is in similar terms, namely: That the Silo Subsidies (Scotland) Scheme 1965, a draft of which was laid before this House on 13th May, be approved.

§ Mr. Speaker
Yes, if the House so desires.

§ Mr. Hoy
Both Schemes require to be approved by a Resolution of the House.
I am sure that the House will welcome this affirmative Resolution, which will enable payment of the silo subsidy to continue after the end of next month and so give applicants a final opportunity to apply for subsidy. The present Schemes were made in 1962 and finish on 31st July, 1965; the Schemes now proposed will allow applications to be submitted up to 31st July, 1966, and approved up to the end of that year. They will run on precisely the same lines as the 1962 Schemes and are made under the authority of the Agriculture (Silo Subsidies) Act, 1956. Under the Silo Subsidies Schemes, subsidies are paid towards the cost of constructing or improving a silo to ensile grass or other green matter.
The operations which are eligible for subsidy are set out in the first Schedule and cover all the works necessary for the construction of a silo together with the rate of subsidy payable on each. For 197 each item in the Schedule there is a standard rate of subsidy, and the amount which the farmer receives is calculated by multiplying that rate by the number of square yards, cubic yards or linear yards as the case may be.
As in previous Schemes, there is a maximum subsidy payment of £250 for all silo works on any one agricultural unit; and within this figure there are maxima of £125 for work on silos, excluding the roof, and £125 for work on the roof. The reason for these maxima is that the silo subsidy is not intended to subsidise all silo buildings, but to encourage farmers, and particularly small farmers, to improve their grassland management by introducing them to proper silage making, with the help and advice of the Ministry's National Agricultural Advisory Service.
The success of the Schemes in attaining this objective can be measured from the fact that since the introduction of the subsidy in 1956 50,000 applications have been approved in the United Kingdom at a grant cost of over £8 million. Demand was high during the early years of the subsidy, and in 1957 over 13,000 applications were approved in the United Kingdom at a grant cost of just over £2 million. But since then, as is to be expected with a "once-only" subsidy of this kind, applications have fallen off, and in 1964 were running at only 2,000 a year, involving grant totalling £300,000.
These figures show that most farmers have now taken advantage of the subsidy, and we feel that it has now served its purpose and can be brought to an end with the 1965 schemes. These one-year Schemes will give adequate notice of the termination of the subsidy and give any farmers who have not yet taken advantage of the schemes a final chance to apply. Accordingly, I ask the House to approve the draft Schemes.

§ Mr. Anthony Stodart (Edinburgh, West)
I need not detain the House for long. The Scheme has been of considerable use and it is apparent from the figures given by the Minister that it is tailing off. I think I am right in saying that by 1962 there had been 44,000 applications. As the Minister said, since then, during the past three years, there has been an increase of only 6,000.
198 I suppose that it is reasonable to anticipate that after another year we may have some relationship between this Scheme and the Farm Improvement Scheme. If that were to happen, then I repeat the point which has been made in previous debates on this subject; that the Silo Scheme has always been aimed in particular towards the interests of the small farmer.
When we debated this matter last, in 1962, it was stated that the cost of a typical silo unit was about £500. Therefore, the grant of £250 represented a 50 per cent. grant, which was considerably better than the 33┓ per cent. Farm Improvement Scheme grant. But what is the average cost of a silo unit today? If it has gone up considerably, it follows that the subsidy is now below the 50 per cent. level and might be approaching that of the Farm Improvement Scheme. If any marriage of the schemes is contemplated, I hope that the Government will ensure that silage making on the typical sort of farm will not suffer.
It is interesting, when looking back to the date of June 1962, to note the names of the hon. Members for Edinburgh, East (Mr. Willis), now the Minister of State for Scotland. We had the hon. Gentleman the Member for Motherwell (Mr. Lawson) making one of his infrequent interventions on the subject of agriculture. Both of them rather surprisingly expressed concern at what they described as the sight of sturdy characters being undermined by subsidies and farmers holding out their hands for whatever public assistance they could get. In particular, the present Minister of State was very critical about the possibility of subsidies being paid to those who did not need them.
The hon. Gentleman said: We are entitled to tell the Government that we think that certain people ought not to have them".—[OFFICIAL REPORT, 28th June, 1962; Vol. 661, c. 1506. I was somewhat surprised to read in the Scottish Farmer, last Saturday, a report of a statement made by the Minister of State at the conclusion of a tour of the outer islands. According to the report, the hon. Gentleman said: The rate of grant for silos for crofters formerly at 85 per cent, is being reduced to 661⅔ per cent.". 199 I say without hesitation that if there is one body of farmers who need these subsidies—and the Minister of State made great play with this point three years ago—it is the small crofters, particularly those of the Western Isles. Their need is extremely great if they are to make enough silage to keep their breeding stock through the winter months. I would, therefore, be grateful if the Minister would explain why those who are in great need of this subsidy are to have it reduced.
If the hon. Gentleman can give us an indication of how his mind is working on the future of the Scheme—because silage is still a highly valuable product on the farms—the House will be grateful and we shall be obliged.

§ Mr. Clifford Kenyon (Chorley)
I want to raise one point on this Scheme. Does the Department follow up the use made of these silos after they have been built and subsidy paid on them? Many silos which have been built and had subsidy paid make remarkably good implement sheds. I know that some are built for that purpose and used for that purpose after about 12 months.
Many farmers fall out of love with silage in a very short time. They make silage when it is a bad year for hay, but if the weather is good they make hay and leave the silage and the silo is used for another purpose. A large number of silos have been used for only one year for the proper purpose and are now used for entirely different purposes.

§ Mr. Hoy
I am sorry to hear of any misuse of the silo subsidy. I come to the defence of the farmer. We do not seek to deny that these subsidies are for the benefit of the small farmer. That is 200 their purpose and it may be that they have fulfilled their function. On the whole, most people who take the trouble to build a silo with the help of this grant will use it for the purpose for which it was built.
The hon. Member for Edinburgh, West (Mr. Stodart) has an absolute fascination for reading past speeches of my hon. Friend the Member for Edinburgh, East (Mr. Willis). I find it difficult to understand how the hon. Member for Edinburgh, West finds time to read what Schemes are about when he is so much engaged in reading speeches by my hon. Friend. On this occasion my hon. Friend the Member for Motherwell (Mr. Lawson) was also brought in. I am sure that what my hon. Friends were saying was that if these subsidies were to be provided from taxpayers' money we should make sure that we got value for the money.
The hon. Member asked what was to be the future in regard to silos. There will be no grant after the end of July next year and it may be that we shall have to consider some further Schemes in connection with the Farm Improvement Scheme. It is not for me to make a pronouncement on that at this time, but I give the hon. Member the assurance that these points will not be overlooked when we consider the whole Farm Improvement Scheme. We would obviously give consideration to any future use of silos in that respect.