HC Deb 26 July 1965 vol 717 cc16-7
21. Mrs. Shirley Williams

asked the Minister of Labour how many workers in the engineering industry are supplied under agreements with labour-only subcontractors; and what proportion they are of the total number employed in the industry.

Mr. Gunter

I regret that the information is not available.

Mrs. Williams

My right hon. Friend will be aware that this practice is growing in areas which are short of skilled labour. Will he give an assurance that he will resist any attempt to undermine his own efforts for better redundancy payments, industrial training reforms and retraining as a result of the growth of this system in the engineering industry?

Mr. Gunter

I will certainly give that assurance, but I would point out to my hon. Friend that some of the problems which arise are really best left for examination by both sides of industry.

22. Mrs. Shirley Williams

asked the Minister or Labour how many workers in the building industry are supplied under agreements with labour-only sub-contractors; and what proportion they are of the total employed in this industry.

Mr. Gunter

I regret that the information is not available.

Mrs. Williams

Would my right hon. Friend agree that this system is an alternative system to the attempt to decasualise the building trade, and that with the growth of industrialised methods it is important to begin thinking and moving forward on this front?

Mr. Gunter

Yes, indeed, Sir. I am glad to note that the national joint council, representing both sides of industry, has had a look at this.

Mr. Heffer

Would not my right hon. Friend agree that this is a very dangerous and pernicious practice and that if it is allowed to expand to any great degree it will undermine the negotiated agreements in the building industry? Will he give an assurance that he will use his influence as far as possible with both sides of the building industry to ensure that the practice is cut out altogether?

Mr. Gunter

I have already indicated that we are watching the dangerous implications of the system very closely. However, I would rather that it were left at present to see what conclusions are arrived at by both sides of industry. They are now negotiating on this matter.