§ Q1. Mr. William Hamiltonasked the Prime Minister if he will introduce legislation providing that all Members of Parliament in both Houses shall register all their financial interests in outside bodies, and that such a register should be freely available to the public.
§ The Prime Minister (Mr. Harold Wilson)No, Sir.
§ Mr. HamiltonI am disappointed by my right hon. Friend's reply. Does he not agree that if we had had this information 272 in the course of the debates on the Finance Bill we could have been even better able to judge the objectivity of the the speeches made? Would my right hon. Friend consider the possibility of hiring, perhaps on an ad hoc basis, Mr. Roth to do the job for us when the next Finance Bill comes before us.
§ The Prime MinisterI cannot imagine that any legislation would provide information on this subject that my hon. Friend is not able to obtain as a result of his own diligent researches. I should have thought that any criticism there might be of speeches on the Finance Bill from right hon. and hon. Members opposite would arise, not so much from any particular interest that may be described in their speeches, but more in their sheer reaction against any suggestion of modernising our tax structure.
§ Sir G. NicholsonIs it not deplorable to suggest that members of all parties act otherwise than in the best interests of the country?
§ The Prime MinisterI did not quite catch what the hon. Gentleman said, but I think that there has been a longstanding tradition in this House that hon. Members who have an interest to declare, declare that interest, even apart from any votes.
§ Sir G. NicholsonThat is not an answer to my question, Mr. Speaker. May I repeat it?
§ Mr. SpeakerPerhaps we can have another one on the way and then come back.
§ Mr. GrimondWould not the Prime Minister agree that if Members were to register their financial interest with outside bodies, outside bodies would have to register their interest with Members? There are some Members who, quite properly in my view, are supported in one way or another by outside bodies. We will get involved in very difficult territory if we pursue this much further.
§ The Prime MinisterI remember more than once from the Opposition Benches wondering whether we would not get into a position where we might need to have legislation—
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. I suspend the sitting for four minutes.
§ Sitting resumed—
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. In view of the entirely exceptional circumstances, I ask the House to give me leave to defy the Standing Order and to allow another five minutes for Question Time.
§ The Prime MinisterThank you, Mr. Speaker. I am sure that will be for the convenience of the House.
I think the right hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland (Mr. Grimond) was referring to registration of outside bodies. On a number of occasions some of us have raised the question of whether we were getting in danger of a situation like that in Washington where they have had to register lobbies. I do not think that is the position, although there have been problems in the past, not where an hon. Member has made a speech and declared an interest, but where there has been some use by hon. Members in promoting social occasions downstairs and in other ways of the promotion of companies which have employed hon. Members particularly as public relations officers. I think a great deal of improvement has taken place in this matter as a result of concern expressed in all parts of the House.
§ Mr. RidsdaleDoes the Prime Minister recall that exactly 10 years ago to the day he was challenged to declare what his interest was in the timber trade, as reported in the OFFICIAL REPORT, Vol. 543 at col. 1952? As he has taken 10 years to meet that challenge, will he say what those interests were?
§ The Prime MinisterI thank the hon. Member for that little personal reference. I have not looked this up myself, but I think he will find that on 30th November, 1951, which is more than 10 years ago, I had already declared such interest as I had. Although I had no financial interest he will find that that occurred as soon as I was appointed to a minor position in the timber industry. It was announced publicly. It was also announced when I gave it up and I announced it in this House. [HON. MEMBERS: "Hear, hear."]
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. Mr. William Hamilton.
§ Sir G. Nicholsonrose—
§ Mr. SpeakerI had half forgotten the promise I had made.
§ Sir G. NicholsonI asked whether the Prime Minister did not regret and deplore anything in speeches and questions in this House which tends to imply that hon. Members of all parties act otherwise than in what they conceive to be the best interests of the House? Will he enhance his own reputation and add to the dignity of the House by doing all he can to raise the level of political controversy?
§ The Prime MinisterYes, Sir. I do not think the preceding question particularly helped to raise the level of political controversy. I think some of us in this House would like to see occasionally at Question Time or in debates a concrete suggestion made on policy instead of the constant muck-racking we are getting.