HC Deb 10 February 1965 vol 706 cc368-70
20. Mr. Hawkins

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food what is his Department's estimate of the number of small farmers who earn less than an agricultural worker's wage.

Mr. Peart

There is no official estimate as regards full-time small farmers. As regards other small farmers, about 175,000 agricultural holdings in England and Wales, or one-half of the total, are estimated to provide only part-time employment for the occupiers. Most of these occupiers are likely to earn less than a farm worker's wage from their holdings but the majority have other jobs or sources of incomes.

Mr. Hawkins

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that on 16th December, in answer to a Written Question of mine about one of his advisers, Mr. Emrys Jones, he said that in answer to a question at Colchester, Mr. Emrys Jones had said that there were 60,000 small farmers who fell into this category? If he agrees with his official, can he say when he will raise the standard of the incomes of small farmers to farm workers' wages, plus the interest on the capital invested in their farms?

Mr. Peart

The position of the small farmer will also be carefully considered at the Annual Price Review.

Mr. Rankin

If a large landowner developed only a small corner of his estate for farming, would he be regarded as a small farmer?

37. Mr. J. E. B. Hill

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food whether he will institute a comprehensive survey of the position of small farmers to find out, having regard to local physical conditions, what correlation there may be between size of business and the age of the occupier, length of occupation, agricultural training and experience, amount of capital available, off-farm earnings, use of advisory and other official facilities and grants, use of credit and any co-operative services available, and any other relevant factors.

Mr. John Mackie

Various surveys carried out in the last few years have yielded a good deal of information on the position of the small farmer. I shall keep in mind the desirability of improving our knowledge, but I do not think that the additional information to be gained from a comprehensive survey would justify the very large effort and cost it would entail.

Mr. Hill

Is it really so involved? It is the hard core of the problem which is really complicated, and that relates to those full-time small farmers whose scale of business is not large enough to give a satisfactory income. Such a survey, I believe, has been carried out in America with very good results.

Mr. Mackie

Yes, I would agree with the hon. Gentleman but there is a tremendous amount of information already available, if he wants it and will read it carefully. Surveys of that description have to be accurate, and they are obtained at considerable cost. However, as he knows, there are various surveys which have been carried out by some colleges and universities and others, and which are very interesting, such as "The Small Farmers Scheme", in Devon; "The Nuffield Farm Project"; "Farmers who earn less than£10 a week", by Professor Britton and Gwyn E. Jones; "The Economic position and prospects of some small farms in Wales". We have all these to go on, and I really think that at the present moment we have sufficient information.

Mr. Prior

If the hon. Gentleman thinks he has sufficient information, will he make certain he uses that information to good effect?

Mr. Mackie

Yes.