HC Deb 11 March 1964 vol 691 cc416-7
14. Miss Herbison

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland how many psychiatric beds are now provided in hospitals for children and adolescents; and what is the waiting period after referral before a child or adolescent is admitted for treatment.

Mr. Noble

There are 55 assessment and treatment beds in children's units and 36 in units for adolescents in Scotland, and beds in other hospitals are made available as appropriate. There are also about 1,450 beds for children and adolescents in mental deficiency hospitals, where active work is now being undertaken. As the waiting period between referral and treatment depends upon the urgency of each case, no average period can be given, but waiting periods may range from over three years to a matter of hours depending on the circumstances.

Miss Herbison

But surely the right hon. Gentleman must be aware that that is not a satisfactory picture at all? It is shocking that a child who is referred for psychiatric treatment should be kept waiting for three years. What further proposals has the right hon. Gentleman for ensuring that when a child is referred for such examination he will not have to wait for any length of time, let alone three years?

Mr. Noble

We all accept that the present arrangements are not perfect. I do not disagree with the hon. Lady's assessment, but I think that the Scottish Health Services Council's Report on Medical Services for Child Guidance, which the regional hospital boards have and are studying, will help. It is not just a problem of buildings; it is a problem of staff as well. In cases of urgency, children can be admitted in a matter of a few hours. That is the best that we can do at this precise moment.

Mr. Ross

Surely it is the under statement of the year for the right hon. Gentleman to say that the present arrangements are not perfect? It is some time since we passed the Mental Health Bill. We have been pressing the Government to do something along these lines for a long time, and now to be offered study, which means further delay, is not good enough. Can the right hon. Gentleman promise us something specific in relation to what is to be done?

Mr. Noble

I think that the allocation of beds for different purposes should stay with the regional hospital boards. They are doing their best to help, but there is no immediate point in allocating beds until staff are available to look after them.

Miss Herbison

As the Secretary of State seems to be suggesting that the difficulty is due to a shortage of staff rather than to a shortage of beds—I think that there is a shortage of both—does he think that the action of this Government in their treatment of nurses' salaries has done anything at all to attract the staff that we need?

Mr. Noble

I think that that is an entirely separate problem, because in this case a great deal of what is necessary is consultant staff. But the problem is one both of beds and of staff, and regional hospital boards should use their rapidly increasing number of beds in the most effective way.