Land Use

HC Deb 21 December 1964 vol 704 cc838-41

12. Mr. Boyd-Carpenter

asked the Minister of Land and Natural Resources at what stage he participates in the decision of planning appeals involving a decision on the use of land; what action he took on the proposal to build a commuter village on proposed Green Belt land at Darley in Kent; and whether he will make a statement on his policy on the use of land of this kind for such purposes.

Mr. Willey

The question whether development in particular cases should be permitted in proposed Green Belts is for my right hon. Friend the Minister of Housing and Local Government as part of his responsibility for the general system of planning control under the Town and Country Planning Acts. It is not part of my responsibility to participate in the deciding of planning appeals unless I am consulted by my right hon. Friend, and I took no action on the proposal mentioned by the right hon. Gentleman.

Mr. Boyd-Carpenter

How can the right hon. Gentleman discharge the responsibility to which he referred in reply to Question No. 6 if he is not even consulted on major planning appeals which determine major matters in respect of the use of land?

Mr. Willey

It is a question of what is a major matter. I think that we should recognise my right hon. Friend's responsibility in respect of town and country planning, because I have the responsibility for providing what has not been provided before, and that is a survey of land use, the determination of land use, and that sort of thing, which has been completely neglected hitherto.

Mr. Deedes

Is the Minister aware that, in terms of land use, this particular decision will seem to make very little sense indeed in the County of Kent? Can he give some further indication about what responsibility he will have when Green Belt matters of this kind come up for decision?

Mr. Willey

The right hon. Gentleman will be aware that this is the responsibility of my right hon. Friend, to whom he should address the Question.

Sir H. Butcher

Does the Minister really mean to say that in cases of this kind he only stands idly by as a silent and impotent spectator?

Mr. Willey

Nothing of the sort. There is a responsibility for these decisions, and the responsibility lies where it does.

15. Mr. Costain

asked the Minister of Land and Natural Resources what techniques he plans for evaluating the comparative uses of land.

Mr. Willey

I am hoping shortly to set up machinery to enable me to contribute advice and information on the most effective use of land and other natural resources in relation to national and regional planning. I am also considering the development of techniques of comparative evaluation of land uses.

Mr. Costain

Does the right hon. Gentleman realise that, again, he is not answering the question? Surely, the House is entitled to some appreciation of how he will evaluate these different uses of land.

Mr. Willey

The hon. Gentleman himself perhaps does not realise how little has been done in the past. This work has been almost entirely neglected. There has been some work at one or two universities, but little more. This is a problem we intend to tackle.

Mr. Boyd-Carpenter

But will the right hon. Gentleman tell us how, when he has the information, he will apply it, if he has nothing to do with planning decisions?

Mr. Willey

Certainly. This will provide us with opportunities for forward planning.

16. Mr. Costain

asked the Minister of Land and Natural Resources what general oversight he proposes to exercise of the use of land throughout the country.

Mr. Willey

In participating in the formulation of national and regional plans for which my right hon. Friend the First Secretary of State has overall responsibility, I shall be concerned, amongst other matters, with general problems of land use, such as changes in the requirements for land with changing economic and social conditions.

Mr. Costain

Does the Minister realise that by his answer to Question No. 12 tabled by my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston-upon-Thames (Mr. Boyd-Carpenter) he has already proved that he has no powers at all in this matter? When he says that there has been no regional survey on this, is he not aware of the Ordnance Surveys laid down in the town planning regulations and the plans that have been passed? How does his Department make any difference?

Mr. Willey

I am satisfied that I have the powers, but if the hon. Gentleman feels that I should have more I will certainly be willing to consider such proposals as he may make.

Mr. Corfield

Does not the right hon. Gentleman's Answer imply that he really requires to be the final arbiter in development plans? If he agrees with that, will he consider whether that is not the sensible co-ordination of duties, rather than splitting them as apparently has been done?

Mr. Willey

What the hon. Gentleman should imply is that we know far too little at present about land use and the technique for providing for better use of our main natural resource.

17. Mr. Corfield

asked the Minister of Land and Natural Resources what proposals he has for a complete land use survey of the British Isles; when he expects such a survey to be completed; and what estimates he has made of the cost and manpower requirements of carrying out such a survey and thereafter keeping it up to date.

Mr. Willey

This is one of the questions I am considering, but I am not yet ready to make proposals.

Mr. Hogg

Can the Minister give some indication of the relationship between his own Department and the Geological Survey, because both this Answer and his previous one indicate that the relationship is, perhaps, not as close as it ought to be?

Mr. Willey

The right hon. and learned Gentleman will be aware that we have made a statement about the new Research Council, and I shall have a close relationship with that Council.

Mr. Corfield

When the right hon. Gentleman carries out this survey, will he bear in mind that it is important to assess the best potential use of land rather than its existing use? Can he confirm that that is his intention?

Mr. Willey

I will certainly bear that in mind, but again I express my surprise that the hon. Gentleman, whilst in office, did not consider this.

Mr. J. E. B. Hill

When carrying out the land survey, does the right hon. Gentleman intend to go into the details of the potential value of agricultural land to the same degree, as for example, the Germans do?

Mr. Willey

I must ask the hon. Gentleman to await my further statement.