§ That a sum, not exceeding £30, be granted to Her Majesty, to make good excesses on certain grants for Civil Services, for the year ended on the 31st day of March 1962.
| SCHEDULE | |||||||||
| Class and Vote | Excess Vote | ||||||||
| £ | s. | d. | £ | s. | d. | ||||
| CLASS II | |||||||||
| 2. FOREIGN OFFICE GRANTS AND SERVICES | £ | s. | d. | ||||||
| Subhead D.7.—United Nations Civil Assistance to the Congo: | |||||||||
| Excess Expenditure | 39 | 8 | 2 | ||||||
| Subhead E.7.—Central Treaty Organisation: Institute of Nuclear Science (Grant in Aid): | |||||||||
| Excess Expenditure | 1,583 | 3 | 0 | ||||||
| Subhead E.9.—Central Treaty Organisation; Agricultural Machinery and Soil Conservation Training Centre (Grant in Aid): | |||||||||
| Excess Expenditure | 2,855 | 12 | 6 | 4,478 | 3 | 8 | |||
| Less—Net savings available on other subheads | 4,468 | 3 | 8 | 10 | 0 | 0 | |||
| 12. DEPARTMENT OF TECHNICAL CO-OPHRATCON | |||||||||
| Subhead C.—Subscription towards the expenses of the Colombo Plan Bureau: | |||||||||
| Excess Expenditure | 206 | 3 | 2 | ||||||
| Less—Net savings available on other subheads | 196 | 3 | 2 | 10 | 0 | 0 | |||
| CLASS IV | |||||||||
| 1. MINISTRY OF EDUCATION | £ | s. | d. | ||||||
| Subhead K.1.—United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organisation: Subscription: | |||||||||
| Excess Expenditure | 1,901 | 0 | 0 | ||||||
| Subhead K.2.—International Bureau of Education: Subscription: | |||||||||
| Excess Expenditure | 3 | 18 | 1 | 1,904 | 18 | 1 | |||
| Less—Net savings available on other subheads | 1,894 | 18 | 1 | 10 | 0 | 0 | |||
| Total, Civil (Excesses) | …£ | 30 | 0 | 0 |
§ Question put and agreed to.
335§ The Deputy-ChairmanI will now hear the hon. Member for Wycombe (Mr. John Hall) on the point of order he wished to raise.
§ Mr. John HallI rise to seek your guidance, Sir Robert. We have just passed a number of Votes. The Army Vote alone totals about £554 million and others £100 million-plus. We have had no opportunity, under our procedure as it stands, to debate these matters.
As I understand it, the duty of Parliament is to scrutinise carefully and critically all expenditures for which we are responsible. But time and again we find that this is quite impossible under the procedure as it exists. How can we avoid passing Votes of this kind on the nod with no opportunity for debate? How can hon. Members find any method of speaking on this kind of expenditure with critical reservations? Does it mean that the procedure must be changed before we can do so, or is there some other method open to us?
§ Mr. Emrys HughesFurther to that point of order, Sir Robert. The point of order raised by the hon. Member for Wycombe (Mr. John Hall) voices also the opinion of many hon. Members on this side of the Committee. We would like to ask your guidance as to how we can alter the procedure under which large sums of money are voted on the nod without adequate consideration by this Committee.
I agree with the hon. Member that yesterday we had an opportunity to discuss large sums spent on the Royal Air Force and on the Royal Navy, but as a result of various hon. Members with expert knowledge trying to get information about the R.A.F. and the Royal Navy—there was no question of obstruction, for they were rising to put questions of very great consideration—we never reached a large percentage of the Army Votes.
What facilities are possible by which the passage on the nod of enormous sums of public money can be obviated? As I have said, there was no obstruction on the Air Force and Navy Votes yesterday, yet, as the hon. Member for Wycombe has said, there was very inadequate consideration of those Votes and no consideration at all of the immense amount of money we have just voted for the Army.
§ The Deputy-ChairmanThe only way to deal with the matter would be to seek an alteration of the procedure of the House. We have, in these last days, proceeded under present Standing Orders and the Chair cannot change them. But if the House wishes to change the procedure it can do so. That is the answer I must give to the hon. Gentleman.
§ Resolutions to be reported.
§ Report to be received Tomorrow; Committee to sit again Tomorrow.