HC Deb 13 March 1963 vol 673 cc1402-5
Mr. Denzil Freeth

I beg to move, in page 19, line 34, to leave out "Subsections (2) to (4)" and to insert "Subsection (2)".

Perhaps it might be convenient for the House, Mr. Deputy-Speaker, if we discussed with this Amendment the following five Amendments:

In page 20, line 11, at end insert: in connection with any such equipment as aforesaid".

In line 13, leave out"question". In line 14, leave out "the" and insert "any".

In line 15, leave out "the" and insert "any".

In line 17, leave out "the weighing or measuring" and insert: any, or any purported, weighing or measuring by means of that equipment".

Mr. Deputy-Speaker

Yes, if that is convenient to the House.

Mr. Freeth

The six Amendments are interconnected. They deal with a point raised in Committee—it is referred to in column 179 of the OFFICIAL REPORT—by the hon. Lady the Member for Stoke-on-Trent, North (Mrs. Slater). She moved an Amendment to page 20, line 17 of the Bill. That Amendment was designed to ensure that the person who issues or uses a written statement of the weight or measure of goods which have not been actually weighed or measured shall be guilty of an offence. The hon. Lady instanced a case in Birmingham where no weighing had taken place but where a weight ticket had been issued.

I agreed then that she had raised an important point and I gave an undertaking to look at the wording of the Clause again in order to make certain that this kind of practice would be prevented by the Bill. These Amendments are designed to produce that effect. They will ensure that if an attendant at a public weighing machine delivers a false statement of the weight of anything, or makes a false record of any weighing, he will be guilty of an offence. It will also make it an offence for any person, whether an attendant in charge of weighing or measuring or some other person, such as the driver of a vehicle, to commit any fraud in connection with weighing or measuring or any purported weighing or measuring by means of public weighing equipment.

This means that if an attendant issues a statement of weight purporting to be the weight of an article, vehicle or animal which he has not actually weighed, he will be guilty of an offence. Similarly, if he does not weigh the vehicle but gives the driver a blank ticket in order that the driver can insert a false statement of weight himself, then both attendant and driver will be guilty of an offence. The Amendments also cover the purloining of tickets by drivers and the insertion of fictitious weighs thereon.

I hope the hon. Lady will agree that we have met the most important of the points she raised in Committee and I therefore commend the Amendments to the House.

Mrs. Slater

I am sure that we are all grateful to the Parliamentary Secretary for these Amendments, as will be the majority of weights and measures inspectors, who have made this point many times in their annual reports. They will be glad that their case has at last been met. As we said in Committee, this sort of fraud is quite easily undertaken, through tickets either being stolen or wrongly filled in. We are now going a long way to preventing these frauds, which have been very difficult for the weights and measures inspectors to deal with so far.

Amendment agreed to.

Further Amendments made: In page 20, line 11, at end insert: in connection with any such equipment as aforesaid".

In line 13, leave out "in question".

In line 14, leave out "the" and insert "any".

In line 15, leave out "the" and insert "any".

In line 17, leave out "the weighing or measuring" and insert: any, or any purported, weighing or measuring by means of that equipment".—[Mr. Denzil Freeth.]

5.45 p.m.

Mr. Denzil Freeth

I beg to move, in line 20, after "If" to insert: in the case of a weighing or measuring of any article, vehicle or animal carried out by means of such equipment as aforesaid". During our discussion in Standing Committee on this Clause, the hon. and learned Member for Liverpool, Edge Hill (Mr. A. J. Irvine) moved an Amendment designed to ensure that a person bringing an article to be weighed or measured, but not actually going so far as to have it weighed or measured, would not be guilty of an offence if he failed to give his name and address when it was demanded of him.

I agreed to look at the drafting of the Clause to make certain that this could not happen, and this Amendment is designed to meet that point. It has the effect of requiring a person's name and address to be given when demanded, only if the weighing or measuring actually takes place.

Mr. Darling

Although I am a layman, I now understand the Clause very well indeed, and I think that this is an occasion when one should pay tribute to the Parliamentary draftsmen. This Clause was very tricky but now, following all these Amendments, it will be quite understandable to the layman. The Parliamentary draftsmen have done a first-class job. As a result of the intervention of my hon. and learned Friend the Member for Liverpool, Edge Hill (Mr. A. J. Irvine), the Clause is now better, with their help, than it was before.

Mr. A. J. Irvine

I support what my hon. Friend the Member for Sheffield, Hillsborough (Mr. Darling) has said about the drafting of this Clause following these Amendments and I am grateful to the Parliamentary Secretary for this Amendment. Although it was a comparatively small point, the Bill as origin. ally drafted might in certain circumstances have been oppressive, but now that difficulty and danger have been overcome.

Amendment agreed to.