HC Deb 26 June 1963 vol 679 cc1317-8
12. Mr. Paget

asked the Minister of Defence how much money was spent on the Kenya Base subsequent to the Lancaster House Conference at which the African future of Kenya was settled.

Mr. Thorneycroft

There were two conferences at Lancaster House. Between the first in 1960, which merely planned the next step in Kenya's constitutional evolution, and the second, about £4¼ million were spent. It would have been imprudent to stop construction at that stage, though new commitments were drastically reduced. After the 1962 conference, at which internal self-government was agreed, a little over £¼ million was spent on completing or paying for work started in earlier years.

Mr. Paget

By 1960, was it not quite clear that every single African leader was on record as saying that a British base in Kenya would not be acceptable to an independent African Kenya? Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that this £4½ million thrown straight down the drain would be more than adequate to cover better pensions for all the widows who have been so shabbily treated and who were referred to in the Questions asked by the hon. Lady the Member for Tynemouth (Dame Irene Ward)?

Mr. Thorneycroft

No, Sir.

Mr. Healey

The Minister, answering a similar Question the other day, expressed his satisfaction at the failure of Her Majesty's Government to predict this type of event. Is this complacency to be regarded as normal in the Government? Does he propose to move in a state of cataleptic trance through every decision of this nature?

Mr. Thorneycroft

I observed that if all of us, either in public or private affairs, could forecast the course of events four or five years ahead, many financial transactions would become much easier.

Mr. Wigg

Before he completely dissolves into tears on this Question, will the Minister persuade those who now hold Kenya's destiny that it would be in the best interests of those in Africa that this base in Kenya should be accepted as a permanent institution and that in the long run it would have the high regard of African opinion?

Mr. Thorneycroft

I think discussions are going on and should go on about the relationships between us and the emerging independent Kenya, which we all wish well, but there are more difficult questions than the general strategic base in an independent Kenya. I shall, however, bear in mind what the hon. Member for Dudley (Mr. Wigg) has said.

Mr. F. Harris

While fully supporting what the hon. Member for Dudley (Mr. Wigg) said in his question, is it not as well to remind ourselves that nothing has yet been decided, so far as we know, about the base in Kenya with all its implications? Should we not remind ourselves that, contrary to what has been said by hon. Members opposite, Mr. Ngala was very much in favour of the maintenance of a military base in Kenya, and Mr. Mboya himself at the time of the election said that K.A.N.U. itself would like to see the retention of the base?

Mr. Thorneycroft

These are all very proper considerations to bear in mind, but, as these discussions are going on and being conducted by my right hon. Friend, I could not add very much further to them.