HC Deb 30 January 1963 vol 670 cc920-3
22. Commander Pursey

asked the Minister of Defence if he will state the increases in the ordinary Armed Forces widows' pensions, on 1st January, 1963, for the over-60 widows of generals, Army captains and privates, and equivalent ranks in the Royal Navy and Royal Air Force, and for the widows of other ranks whose husbands were pensioned before 1st September, 1950.

Mr, Thorneycroft

As the Answer consists of a table of figures I will, with permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Commander Pursey

Will the Minister assure the House that there will not be further comparatively large increases in the pensions of officers and officers' widows until after more pennies per day have been added to the meagre pensions of the widows of other ranks? [HON.

Rank of husband (Army equivalent used) Those bereaved before 4th November, 1958 Those bereaved on or after 4th November, 1958
1919 Code 1945 Code 1950 Code 1956 Code 1959 Code 1960 Code
p.a. p.a. p.a. p.a. p.a. p.a. p.a.
General … … £59 £70 £73 £78 £79 not applicable £37
Captain … … £15 £17 £20 £20 £21 not applicable £9

The above increases from 1st January, 1963, assume that the rates drawn are maximum rates.

p.w. p.w. p.w. p.w. p.w. p.w. p.w.
Private (37 years' service). 1s. 9d. not applicable not applicable 3s. 6d. 4s. 1d. 2s. 1d. not applicable (where husband gave full-time service since 31st August, 1950)

The widows of other ranks whose husbands were pensioned before 1st September, 1950 received no pensions unless their husbands held the rank of Warrant Officer Class 1. The pension increases from 1st January, 1963, for such widows are:—

Rank of husband (Army equivalent used) Those bereaved before 4th November, 1958 Those bereaved on or after 4th November, 1958
1919 Code 1945 Code
p.w. p.w. p.w.
Warrant Officer I (37 years' service) 3s. 2d. 3s. 3d. 3s. 3d.
NOTE: All increases shown above take account of all pensions increases, where applicable other than the special additional increase at age 70 in the 1962 Measure.
23. Commander Pursey

asked the Minister of Defence, if he will state the number of years that generals, Army captains and privates, and equivalent ranks in the Royal Navy and Royal Air Force, on normal engagements, have to wait, after being pensioned, for an over-60 increase in their long-service pension.

Mr. Thorneycroft

As the Answer contains a number of figures I will, with permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

MEMBERS: "Reading."] We always have this support for other ranks' pensions from the other side of the House, yet no hon. Member opposite has ever dealt with the pensions of the other ranks. I repeat that these increases should not be made until more pennies per day have been added to the meagre pensions of the widows of other ranks and pensions awarded to widows whose husbands died before 1st September, 1950, who now receive no Service pension because of the opposition to these pensions by hon. Members opposite?

Mr. Thorneycroft

I fully recognise the interest which the hon. and gallant Member takes in this important matter, but the Question asks for some information and he will receive it. Perhaps he will then consider it and, if he wishes, put another Question.

Following is the table:

Commander Pursey

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the number of figures involved in this and the previous Question are fewer than half a dozen—[Interruption.]Who is running this House? Will the right hon. Gentleman say why the ex-Service man with the lowest pension should have to wait the longest period for an increase? Why should a man who has already served 22 years for his pension have to serve another 20 years for his first increment, in view of the fact that civil servants receive their increase when they become pensionable, or shortly afterwards, and Service officers receive their increases at much earlier periods than do other ranks who have served under them? When will the Conservative Party do something about this anomaly which is a great disgrace to our present welfare system?

Mr. Thorneycroft

Perhaps the hon. and gallant Gentleman will look at the information with which I am providing him and then ask another Question.

Following is the Answer: The current arrangements are as follows: The average age of retirement of admirals, generals and air chief marshals is about 57,½59 and 58 respectively and they would therefore be required to wait up to ½ years before getting a pension increase. Certain Supplementary List lieutenants (R.N.) who have been entered for duty as aircrew go at age 38—with 22 years to wait before being eligible for any pension increase; Special Duties List lieutenants (R.N.) would normally serve to age 50—with 10 years to wait for any pension increase. Captains, if not promoted to major, go between the ages of 37 and 42, with between 18 and 23 years to wait; if they are captain quarter-master they stay until 53 with 7 years to wait. Flight lieutenants normally retire at any age from 38 to 55: they would therefore have to wait from 5 to 22 years. Ratings/other ranks/airmen normally need to complete 22 years service to qualify for pension and if they went after doing so they would have to wait up to 20 years. If required, their service may be extended up to (and exceptionally beyond) age 55, when they would have only 5 or fewer years to, wait for any pension increase.