§ Q5. Mr. A. Hendersonasked the Prime Minister whether, in view of the different views of Soviet and Western 1583 scientists, he will discuss with President Kennedy a proposal for the appointment of a committee of independent scientists by the United Nations to investigate and report on the problem of the detection of all nuclear tests.
§ The Prime MinisterAs I explained to the hon. Member for Wood Green (Mrs. Butler) on 15th May, the Russians have repeatedly ignored suggestions at Geneva that their scientists should meet others to discuss this problem. That being so, I do not think any purpose would be achieved by trying to transfer the problem to the United Nations.
§ Mr. HendersonWould not an impartial investigation by a body of neutral scientists of the facts of verification be of the greatest value to public opinion throughout the world, especially in view of the fact that there is direct conflict of views and advice between the scientists of the Soviet Union on the one side and the scientists of the United Kingdom and the United States on the other?
§ The Prime MinisterWhile I accept that the opinions of independent scientists might be valuable, the fact remains that it is the scientists of the nuclear Powers who naturally have the greatest and most extensive knowledge of this matter. In the last resort progress depends on reconciling the views of the scientists who advise the Governments of the nuclear Powers, and if we were to exclude them from this work I do not think that this would necessarily lead to what we really want. I wish that we had an agreement by the Russians that our scientists and theirs should meet together, which is what we persuaded the Russians to do three years ago.
§ Q8. Mr. Masonasked the Prime Minister, in view of the co-operative effort between the United States Government and Her Majesty's Government in testing nuclear devices, and the sharing of resulting scientific information, if he will now give an assurance that Her Majesty's Government will not test any more nuclear weapons in Nevada, United States of America.
§ The Prime MinisterWe have no present intention of testing further nuclear devices in Nevada. It would be wrong, however, for me to give any 1584 firm assurance for the future which we cannot foresee.
§ Mr. MasonCan I not press the right hon. Gentleman to take this a stage further? If it be true, as he says, that we are receiving full scientific information on all the tests conducted jointly at Christmas Island and elsewhere by the Americans and ourselves, why is it necessary for us to go ahead at any time in the future with an independent series of nuclear tests?
§ The Prime MinisterCertain weapons are designed in Britain for British purposes, and, although they make use of information received, these devices— whether safety or otherwise— have to be fully tested themselves.
§ Mr. PavittHas the right hon. Gentleman had time to study the article in theWillesden Chronicleby Alan Ereira which I sent to him ten days ago? Is he aware that His Excellency the United States Ambassador is forwarding a copy to the White House? Does not the Prime Minister think that this 17-year-old schoolboy is showing a much greater sense of responsibility about testing than the statesmen of Britain, the United States and the Soviet Union?
§ The Prime MinisterI very much regret that by some error I have not had this article brought to me, but I will see that I read it this evening.
§ Q11. Mr. Dribergasked the Prime Minister how many atmospheric nuclear tests have now taken place near Christmas Island; and whether he has yet received an approximate estimate of the damage to human health likely to result from these tests.
§ The Prime MinisterThe answer to the first part of the Question is 13, all of which have been reported in the Press. On the second part of the Question, I have nothing to add to the answers I gave to the hon. Member on 8th May and 10th April.
§ Mr. DribergWhile accepting the Prime Minister's assurances that the fallout which causes the damage to human health is being kept to a minimum in these tests, may I ask him if he realises that the word "minimum" is meaningless unless there is some definition of it and of the number of cases involved?
1585 Does he not yet know whether the number of new cases of bone cancer and leukaemia is likely to be of the order of 10,000, or 100,000, or 1 million, and should this not have some effect on his assent to these tests?
§ The Prime MinisterNo increase has been detected by the Atomic Energy Authority in the incidence of radioactivity in the air attributable to these tests. I would refer the hon. Gentleman to the Second Report of the Medical Research Council published in 1960, which dealt with this whole question. I would not wish to summarise in a sentence that very carefully balanced Report.
§ Mr. DribergIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that he referred me on a previous occasion to a report of a United Nations Committee in 1958 and that when I looked at it I found that it did essay tentative figures of the kind I had asked for? Why are they not obtainable now?
§ The Prime MinisterI do not think it would be possible to obtain them. But I will see if I can make a fuller statement at a later stage. This is a very difficult and complicated matter. It would be wrong to lay downex cathedradecisions on such a subject.