HC Deb 07 March 1962 vol 655 cc393-5
34. Mr. Paget

asked the Secretary of State for War when he proposes to undertake the review of Army pay in accordance with Command 954 Service Pay and Pensions, February, 1960; and whether he will give an assurance that the pay pause will not affect this undertaking.

The Secretary of State for War (Mr. John Profumo)

I would refer the hon. and learned Gentleman to the announcement made by my right hon. Friend the Minister of Defence during the Defence debate on 5th March.

Mr. Paget

Now that the right hon. Gentleman has an all-voluntary Army in circumstances of full employment, does he not feel that the time has come when he must experiment in being honest with it and fulfilling the bargains upon which he secures his recruits?

Mr. Profumo

"Very dangerous", did the hon. and learned Gentleman say? I simply do not accept what he says, that we are in any breach of any obligations. [HON. MEMBERS: "Oh."] No. We undertook to review Service pay automatically every two years. That is what the Grigg Committee recommended. That is our undertaking, and that is exactly what we have done.

Mr. Paget

Is the right hon. Gentleman unaware that that undertaking was extended by his predecessor into specific terms—not only to review, but to pay in accordance with the review? It would, one would have thought, if there was an undertaking to review, obviously have followed, but it was actually spelled out by the right hon. Gentleman's predecessor the present Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations.

Mr. Profumo

I think that if the hon. and learned Gentleman reads the White Paper, which will be published, he will see that we have fulfilled our obligation, and I believe that the Army as a whole will understand this.

Mr. Gordon Walker

Is the right hon. Gentleman really saying now that to maintain an obligation he has merely to look at it and not to do anything about it? Is he saying that if he merely looks at it he has carried out his obligation which the men in the Service expected him to carry out?

Mr. Profumo

What I said was exactly what was correct. If the right hon. Gentleman looks at the Government's comments on the Grigg Report, he will see that the Government agreed that Service pay and conditions should be looked at regularly at intervals of not more than two years, and that is what we have done.

Mr. Driberg

Is the right hon. Gentleman proposing to circulate copies of the White Paper to all ranks in the Army, and does he suppose that recruits who now believe they have been cheated by the Government will be happy about it when they read the White Paper? Is he himself happy at having to defer this increase of pay?

Mr. Profumo

I have already said that I believe that what has been done is correct, and it conforms with the policies described in paragraphs 8 and 9 of the White Paper on Incomes Policy. In spite of all that the hon. Gentleman has tried to do to sow seeds of discord, I believe that the Army will accept this as fair.

Mr. Gordon Walker

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that no one is sowing seeds of discord except himself?