HC Deb 03 July 1962 vol 662 cc254-6
7. Mr. Hale

asked the President of the Board of Trade what reply he has sent to the letter from the clerk to the Chadderton Urban District Council written on behalf of the council calling attention to the serious decline in output and employment in the cotton textile industry.

Mr. N. Macpherson

Representations in similar terms have been received from a large number of local authorities in the cotton belt. They have been advised that their representations have been taken into account during the Government's consideration of the issues involved.

Mr. Hale

Since this representation was made after Government consideration of the issues involved, how can it have been taken into account at that stage? Is the hon. Gentleman aware that very grave and heavy burdens are being put upon local councils by the closure of mills, by the loss of rateable value and by the increased need for social services, while, in the meantime, we are subjected to a peripatetic procession of Ministers deploring the devastation caused by their own policy? Will the hon. Gentleman bear in mind that the difference of view taken by his right hon. Friend and the Minister of Labour and the Lord Privy Seal about the importance of Commonwealth trade is causing considerable apprehension and prospects of distress?

Mr. Macpherson

I am not certain how that last question relates to the Question on the Order Paper.

The hon. Gentleman will be aware that in his constituency no great problem is arising because there are only 1. 5 per cent. of the total insured population unemployed at present and it cannot, therefore, be said that any very great burden is being placed on the local authorities in this regard. As regards Industrial Development Certificate policy, which is one of the matters raised by the council in question, we are, of course, prepared to steer industries to these areas provided that they cannot be steered to development districts.

Mr. S. Silverman

Can the hon. Gentleman explain where the Board of Trade obtains the figures which it constantly inflicts upon the House in regard to percentages of unemployment in the cotton belt? The figures quoted by the Board of Trade, repeated by the hon. Gentleman today, are very different from the official figures given to us by the Ministry of Labour in the constituencies. Are these figures being specially prepared or dealt with in some way so as to calm the fears of the House of Commons? Does not the hon. Gentleman know that in Nelson there is now 8 per cent. unemployment?

Mr. Macpherson

I think that the difficulty arises because the figures normally given by the Ministry of Labour include temporarily stopped.

Mr. Silverman

No.

Mr. Macpherson

Yes, they include temporarily stopped, whereas we deal with the figures of wholly unemployed, which are different. For example, I can tell the hon. Member for Oldham, West (Mr. Hale) that the percentage of wholly unemployed and temporarily stopped in his constituency was 2. 3 as against the 1. 5 per cent. which I gave earlier.

Mr. Silverman

Does not the hon. Gentleman realise that talking about temporarily stopped in that way conveys a false impression? Is it not true that the only difference between the permanently stopped and the temporarily stopped is the identity of the unemployed, and the percentage of temporarily stopped is as permanent as the percentage of the totally unemployed, so that cutting down the figures by leaving the temporarily stopped out of account is very deceptive?

Mr. Macpherson

This is really a matter for my right hon. Friend the Minister of Labour. We are in touch with him. The fact is that the temporarily stopped are the temporarily stopped on a particular day and the number may be very much affected by, for instance, building labour unable to build on that day.