§ 38. Mr. Doddsasked the Minister of Transport what was the nature of the reply received from the Dartford Rural District Council to the letter sent by his Department in respect of the depositing by that council of a large number of caravans, lorries and sundry other articles on the grass verge of the A.2 trunk road, near Dartford, on 20th January.
§ Mr. HayI understand that, in accordance with the council's standing orders, my Department's letter has been referred to the appropriate committee. We expect to receive a reply after this committee's next meeting, which will be taking place shortly.
§ Mr. DoddsDoes the hon. Gentleman realise that this was a rowdy meeting and that it was a dodge which put the matter off until the next meeting? Does he appreciate that the meeting will not be held for one month? Is he not aware that 300 people are living on the verge of one of our busiest roads and that deaths are expected at any moment? Is 1309 the Ministry going to be so spineless as to allow a council to act like this, having broken the law in Section 128 of the Highways Act? Cannot he do something about it and not wait a month? What would happen to an individual if he put something on the verge of a highway'? What will he do about it?
§ Mr. HayThe hon. Gentleman has put a number of supplementary questions, and I cannot promise to answer them all.[HON. MEMBERS: "Answer one."] We have drawn the attention of the Council, whom we regard as primarily responsible in this matter, to the fact that these people have been put on the verge of a trunk road without any authority. We must go through the normal processes here, and we have asked the council to deal with the matter urgently. I understand that the next meeting of the appropriate committee is on 27th February, and I think we must give it the opportunity to have second thoughts on this matter and to take the action which we have asked it to take.
Mr. J. WellsIs my hon. Friend aware that Dartford is not in the Erith and Crayford constituency? Will he please give such assistance as his Department can to all councils which have problems of gypsies on the highway?
§ Mr. HayThe question of the problems of gypsies goes a little wider than my right hon. Friend's responsibilities. He is concerned here because these people have been allowed to go on the verge of a trunk road. I think that I should go far beyond the bounds of my right hon. Friend's responsibilities if I were to deal with the whole of this subject today.
§ Mr. MellishIs the Minister aware that these people have been made to go where they are at the moment and to break the law? Apart from all these arguments which we have read about, is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that most people are horrified that human beings can be treated in this way?
§ 47. Mr. Doddsasked the Minister of Transport if he will arrange, as a matter of urgency, for litter bins to be provided for the use of the people occupying caravans deposited on the verge of the A.2 trunk road near Dartford and also for 1310 the clearing of these bins at suitable intervals to ensure that this section of the trunk road is as free from litter as possible.
§ Mr. HayNo, Sir. It is not the responsibility of my right hon. Friend to provide litter bins on trunk roads, except at lay-bys. Local authorities, however, have power to provide litter bins on highways, with the consent of the highway authority. The clearing of litter bins is a matter for the local authority.
§ Mr. DoddsIs it not a fact that the Kent County Council has refused to act as agents in this particular case? Is it not revolting that for one month come Saturday 300 people have been on the verge of the road without toilets, without dustbins and without litter bins? How can this go on in this country in 1962? Will not the Government do something about it?
§ Mr. HayAs I said in my original Answer, these matters are not the responsibility of my right hon. Friend.