Pensions and Benefits (Hansard, 5 February 1962)

§ 30. Mr. Driberg
asked the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance if, in view of the long periods that have in 22 the past elapsed between increases in the cost of living and increases in pensions, benefits and National Assistance rates, he will prepare and hold in reserve such measures as may be necessary to meet rapidly the increases in the cost of living that would result from Great Britain's entry into the Common Market.

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
Under Conservative Governments improvements in the rates of National Insurance benefits and of the scales of National Assistance have in general kept well ahead of changes in prices and, I have no doubt, would continue to do so even if the hon. Member's apprehensions about the effect of entry into the Common Market should turn out to be less ill-founded than the hypothesis embodied in the earlier part of his question.

§ Mr. Driberg
Does the right hon. Gentleman seriously deny that there has been such a time-lag on some occasions at any rate in the last ten years? Is there any hypothesis about that? Is he aware that the Home Secretary gave a definite warning of the increases in the cost of living which will result from the entry into the Common Market which he desires. That is not particularly hypothetical, either.

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
So far from there being a time-lag, the real value of the pension is today and has been for some years past substantially higher in real terms than in 1951. So far from there being a time-lag, there has been a leap. Concerning my right hon. Friend's statement on the Common Market, the question of the effect on prices will, of course, be kept under close review.

§ Mr. Ross
Would not the best way to convince my hon. Friend, the House and the country that the Government are sensitive to the needs of people on pension rates and National Assistance be to meet the existing needs? Whatever the right hon. Gentleman may say about the past, will not he agree that the increase in the cost of living, as measured by the retail index, since it was last deemed necessary to announce an increase of pension, is very much greater than that which took place between the last changes?

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
As the hon. Gentleman knows, the rates of benefit 23 were last raised to a new highest ever peak in real terms as recently as last April, and such changes in the retail index as have taken place since then do not affect the proposition that the real value of the pension is not only a great deal higher than it was under the Administration of right hon. and hon. Members opposite but also since previous increases.

§ Mr. Ross
Surely the Minister appreciates that the pensioners had to wait from November until April, and the rise in the cost of living which is relevant here is the rise since November last year. Will the right hon. Gentleman tell us how much the value of the pension has dropped from the high peak of which he is so proud?

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
The relevant consideration is the date of the increase because, as the hon. Gentleman knows, the date of the increase was decided upon and announced at the time of the statement which I made to the House about these increases, and, of course, the amount of the increase had relevance to the date on which it was to take effect. If the hon. Gentleman would care to put down the other question which he raised, I should be happy to answer it.