§ 11. Mrs. Castleasked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether he is now in a position to make a statement on the action taken by Her Majesty's Government at the United Nations to secure the transfer to United Nations custody of all the records of Nazi activities at present in the possession of various Governments.
§ Mr. R. AllanAfter careful consideration, my right hon. and learned Friend has decided not to take this action.
§ Mrs. CastleIs the hon. Gentleman aware that I am not particularly surprised at that Answer? Is he aware also that the United States authorities have refused to allow the German Social Democratic Party access to the documents in the Berlin Document Centre on the ground that they will entertain applications only through official channels? Does not the hon. Gentleman think that it is quite wrong that Dr. Adenauer should have a veto on the use of this material, particularly in view of his refusal to extend the period during which prosecutions for manslaughter can be brought against former Nazis now occupying high positions in Germany?
§ Mr. AllanAs regards the first part of the hon. Lady's supplementary question, I am afraid that I do not know the details of that, but if she sends me details I will certainly look into them. As regards the second part, there is a later Question on the Order Paper about the subject, but knowing the hon. Lady's long interest in this matter, I think that I should tell her that my right hon. and learned Friend has decided to have discussions with the United States authorities to see whether any improvements can be made in the detailed arrangements under which these documents are made available.
§ Mr. ShinwellCan the hon. Gentleman give the reasons why Her Majesty's Government refused to take this action?
§ Mr. AllanIt is much better, seeing the way the documents are at present distributed, that we should have these 890 talks with the United States authorities to see whether we can make the present arrangements work more satisfactorily.
§ 13. Mrs. Castleasked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs what steps have been taken to compile an index of the documents relating to the Nazi period at present in the joint ownership of the British and United States Governments.
§ Mr. R. AllanNo general index has been compiled, but as the documents are declassified an annotated list of them is prepared and is available in the Washington National Archives.
§ Mrs. CastleIs the hon. Gentleman aware that a team of professors from Heidelburg University who wished to examine the documents in the Berlin Document Centre found that the index had been lost? Is it not a fact that the Allied Governments in Washington are in a similar mess? Does not this seem to indicate that the Allied Governments are not interested in getting at the truth about the allegations which have been made, some of which some of us on this side want investigated in the interests of all concerned?
§ Mr. AllanThe index in Washington is measured in terms of cubic feet. As my right hon. and learned Friend told the hon. Lady the other day, 9,000 cubic feet of documents have been dealt with. Those are the ones which have been annotated. There remain 15,000 cubic feet of documents. I am told that there are 60 million sheets which, if there are five sheets to a file, may amount to 12 million files. The task of indexing those would be out of the question.
§ 14. Mr. Stonehouseasked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs what conditions he has laid down as to the use of captured Nazi documents formerly in Allied possession before their return to the West German Government.
§ Mr. R. AllanCaptured Nazi party documents are in the sole possession of the United States Government. None has been handed over to the Federal German Government.
If the hon. Gentleman is referring to captured military documents in Washington under the joint control of the British and United States Governments, where they have been returned to the 891 Federal German Government it has been under arrangements whereby they should remain available for suitable use.
Mr. StonehonseAs there are so many high officials in the West German Administration who are implicated in these documents—they being prominent Nazis during the periods concerned—is it not extremely dangerous that any of these documents should be returned unconditionally?
§ Mr. AllanI cannot accept the first part of the hon. Gentleman's statement. These documents have been made freely available both in the Berlin Centre and the Washington Centre to people who have a genuine interest in exposing Nazi crimes. [HON. MEMBERS: "NO."] Yes, that is true. If the hon. Member for Wednesbury (Mr. Stonehouse) or the hon. Lady the Member for Blackburn (Mrs. Castle) will give instances where it is not so, I should like to look into them.
I would make this one further point to the hon. Gentleman. No document is returned to the German Government without first being microfilmed, and the microfilm is retained in the Washington National Archives and is available.
§ Mr. StonehouseCan the Minister say how a genuine interest in research is assessed?
§ Hon. Members: Oh.
§ Mrs. CastleIs the hon. Gentleman aware that I have already given him two instances where access has been denied? I have just given him the case of the German Social Democratic Party. Does he not think that the official opposition in Western Germany have proper status and title to an interest in this matter? Is he further aware that the American Jewish Congress has been refused access to the Berlin Document Centre by the German Government? How much more evidence does he want before he acts?
§ Mr. AllanThe hon. Lady has just given me those two this afternoon, so I have not had much chance—
§ Mrs. CastleI gave the hon. Gentleman a case two weeks ago.
§ Mr. Allan—but these will be the very points to be discussed in the talks to which I have referred.
§ Sir L. Ungoed-ThomasDoes the Minister realise that when he interprets genuine interest as interest subject to Dr. Adenauer's veto, it is quite absurd, and that what is required is that anybody who has a genuine interest and standing to prosecute in Germany should be able to do so; whereas the whole of the British Government's policy is to give Dr. Adenauer a veto on any action brought?
§ Mr. AllanThat just is not true. I was talking about people outside Germany—researchers in this country, whose applications have to be put through official channels. But it is just to correct these points and to allay suspicions in hon. Gentlemen's minds that these talks are to be held.