HC Deb 27 July 1960 vol 627 cc1646-8
Mr. Callaghan

(by Private Notice) asked the Minister of State for Commonwealth Relations what action he is taking to ensure the safety of British subjects and British-protected subjects in Southern Rhodesia.

The Minister of State for Commonwealth Relations (Mr. C. J. M. Alport)

Responsibility for ensuring the safety of British subjects and British-protected persons in Southern Rhodesia is the responsibility of the Government of Southern Rhodesia.

As I said in the debate earlier today, I am sure that the Government of Southern Rhodesia will have the support of all responsible people in the task of bringing about an end of violence and the restoration of normal peaceful conditions.

Mr. Callaghan

Is it not becoming increasingly clear that the Southern Rhodesian Government do not have the support of many of their own people in maintaining law and order? Does not the right hon. Gentleman recognise that he, too, has a responsibility in this matter? Can he confirm that after forty years of self-government there are still no African members of the Legislature and that hardly any Africans have a vote? Will he represent, through the High Commissioner, to the Government of Southern Rhodesia that their action in arresting reasonable Africans who are demanding elementary political rights is provocative, is stirring up trouble, and is not calculated to stop it?

Mr. Alport

That supplementary question goes far beyond the terms of the hon. Member's original Question. But this might be an opportunity of reminding him, as he was not present during the debate earlier today, that the franchise upon which the present Government of Southern Rhodesia are elected is a franchise which was brought in during the Premiership of Mr. Garfield Todd, and was supported by the hon. Gentleman and his colleagues as being an example of the most liberal form of franchise in contradistinction to the federal form of franchise.

Mr. Callaghan

Does not the right hon. Gentleman recognise that history flows on, and that what may have been appropriate five or six years ago in the context of Africa at that time is not appropriate today? Will he please note that he still has a responsibility for the Colony of Southern Rhodesia, and that, therefore, it is for him and for Her Majesty's Government to make clear to the Government of Southern Rhodesia whether they believe that the policy which is being followed there is likely to promote law and order, or is likely to discourage it?

Will he also take note that many hon. Members on this side of the House as well as this—for I have read the debate today, even though I was not here—[HON. MEMBERS: "How?"] Hon. Members opposite do not realise that there is a typed copy of the debate in the Library of the House. They might care to consult it. I have read every word of the speech made by the hon. Gentleman, and it is quite clear that he still does not understand, or, at any rate, is not prepared to stand up to his responsibilities in this matter by telling the Southern Rhodesian Government that they are responsible for provoking these breaches of law and order if they arrest peaceably-minded Africans who are doing no more than asking for their elementary civil rights.

Mr. Alport

If the hon. Gentleman has studied the report of the debate which we had earlier today he will know that, at some length, I dealt with the limitations of the responsibilities of the United Kingdom in Southern Rhodesia in accordance with the decision of the United Kingdom Parliament at the time of the passing of the Act providing for Southern Rhodesia's Constitution. It is true that time flows on and that clocks cannot be turned back, but when the hon. Gentleman and his colleagues are pressing us sometimes about Southern Rhodesia, that is a point that they should bear in mind.

Mr. Grimond

While it may be true that the Government's responsibilities in Southern Rhodesia are limited, the Minister has expressed, on behalf of the House, the hope that the Southern Rhodesian Government will be able rapidly to restore order, and we all agree. But if Her Majesty's Government are to express that hope, would it not be proper to make it clear that the majority of this House believes that constitutional progress in Southern Rhodesia would make the restoration of order a great deal easier?

Mr. Alport

The question of constitutional discussions was also included in our debate today, and reference has been made to it on previous occasions. I cannot go further than I went earlier today. Perhaps the hon. Gentleman would care to study the report of the debate and then, in due course, we could carry the matter further.