HC Deb 25 February 1960 vol 618 cc586-9
The Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs (Mr. Selwyn Lloyd)

With your permission, Mr. Speaker, and that of the House, I will make a short statement about the possibility of an agreement between the Governments of the Federal Republic of Germany and of Spain for the Federal Republic to have military facilities on Spanish territory.

I heard last month of this possibility. I made it clear that we thought that it would be wiser for Germany to seek the required facilities in countries which are members of the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation. That remains the view of Her Majesty's Government.

Mr. Gaitskell

Is the Foreign Secretary aware that there is widespread concern about this matter on both sides of the House? While we welcome his statement so far as it goes, will he, as soon as possible, make a further and fuller statement?

Secondly, can the right hon. and learned Gentleman at least tell us whether it is his opinion that this is essentially a matter for N.A.T.O., and only for N.A.T.O., to decide, and, if that is so, how it comes about that without any discussion within N.A.T.O., apparently, the German authorities have begun to negotiate on this agreement?

Thirdly, can he assure us that within N.A.T.O. itself Her Majesty's Government will do everything in their power to prevent this agreement coming off?

Mr. Lloyd

There are 10 Questions on the Order Paper for Monday about this matter, which I will do my best to answer. One of the difficulties is to know exactly what is the present position. I am doubtful whether there are, in fact, any proposals, let alone agreements. Certainly, as the right hon. Gentleman said, N.A.T.O. has not considered the matter.

Mr. Gaitskell

If N.A.T.O. has not considered the matter, and a matter of this kind should first go to N.A.T.O., is it not the general understanding, is it not at least implicit in the Paris Agreements, for instance, that a matter of this kind would first have to be approved by the N.A.T.O. Council before Germany acted independently?

Mr. Lloyd

My view is that specific proposals should certainly go to N.A.T.O. first, but I do not think that there are specific proposals.

Mr. Healey

Is it not the case that if the negotiations succeed, Germany will be sabotaging the provisions of the Western European Union Treaty for the control of her armaments? Can the right hon. and learned Gentleman say whether The Times is right in its report from Bonn this morning that the German Government concealed their contacts in Spain on this issue for two months before acquainting the N.A.T.O. Council with them; and that Mr. Strauss flagrantly disregarded advice tendered by General Norstad in sending a three-man mission to Spain last week? Would he not agree that that type of conduct is calculated to undermine Western confidence in Germany's loyalty to the alliance?

Mr. Lloyd

I think that detailed questions of that sort are the kind which I should endeavour to answer on Monday. A number of statements, some apparently official and some inspired, are coming out from a number of capitals in Europe and I had better sort out all those statements before I get drawn into answering these questions.

Vice-Admiral Hughes Hallett

Does my right hon. and learned Friend agree that Western European Union is affected by this matter even more immediately, perhaps, than is N.A.T.O.? Is it not the fact that the position of all the signatory Powers in Western European Union is the same in one respect, namely, that any base established on the mainlaid of Europe must be open to visits by members of the Arms Control Agency? Can my right hon. and learned Friend say whether the position has been made clear to the Spanish Government and whether the Spanish Government would agree to such visits and such inspections?

Mr. Lloyd

My hon. and gallant Friend is asking me for an interpretation of the revised Brussels Treaty. At present, I am disposed to think that my hon. and gallant Friend has put it perfectly correctly and that bases in Europe should be inspected by the Arms Control Agency. That, of course, is relevant to this project, if it ever comes to anything.

Mr. A. Henderson

Will the Foreign Secretary make it clear that the Government do not share the view, expressed in The Times this morning, that if the Federal Government of Germany take steps to manufacture rockets and nuclear weapons in Spain they would not be in breach of the Paris Agreements of 1954? Surely it would be a flagrant breach of those agreements if the Federal Government sought to manufacture nuclear weapons even in Spain?

Mr. Lloyd

Certainly, it would be quite contrary to the spirit of that agreement.

Sir T. Moore

Will my right hon. and learned Friend say whether I am right in my recollection that no protest was made when the United States established bases in Spain, the United States which is also a partner in the alliance and which did so unilaterally? If so, why should there be a protest now when exactly the same action has been taken by another partner in the alliance?

Mr. Lloyd

Whatever my hon. Friend may say, I still stick to the terms of my original statement. I think that it would be wiser for the Federal Republic to seek these facilities in countries which are members of the alliance.

Mr. R. Edwards

Is the Foreign Secretary aware that negotiations are well advanced for the building of a German missile establishment in Bilbao, and that in Bilbao that fact is well known? Is he also aware that there are three very large bases in Spain outside the control of N.A.T.O.? Is he further aware that the Americans are now shifting the base from Morocco to Spain?

Will not the Foreign Secretary now agree that the whole of the Mediterranean is apparently to be defended from a Fascist country, although that defence is supposed to be to protect Western democracy? Finally, will not the Foreign Secretary agree that one cannot defend human freedom from a country where human freedom has been blacked out for the last twenty years?

Mr. Lloyd

The question of United States bases goes very wide of the statement which I made to the House. The question of the construction of a factory in Bilbao for making missiles is a matter of which I was not aware. I will certainly inquire into it.

With regard to the general question of our policy towards Spain and our capacity to influence Spanish policies, I would ask the hon. Gentleman and other hon. Gentlemen to consider whether their way of doing it is the right way. I should have thought that the experience of 1946 and the effect that that had on the internal affairs of Spain would have been a lesson to them.

Several Hon. Members

rose—

Mr. Speaker

It is manifest that we cannot debate this matter now. There is no Question before the House.