HC Deb 14 April 1960 vol 621 cc1446-8
4. Mr. A. J. Irvine

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer to what extent the agreement between Her Majesty's Government and Richard Thomas and Baldwins Ltd. for a loan to a maximum of £70 million to the company will affect the rate of progress of devesting the remaining assets which are held by the Iron and Steel Holding and Realisation Agency.

Mr. Barber

The House has already been informed that it is the Government's intention to proceed with devesting as energetically as possible, but I cannot answer the hypothetical question on the rate of progress which might be achieved.

Mr. Irvine

Will the Economic Secretary give a more forthcoming reply? Here is an asset whose capital structure is greatly affected by the loan of public money. Surely that is likely to have an effect on the timetable of the investing, and should not that effect be fully explained to the House?

Mr. Barber

At the time when the loan of £70 million was announced to the House the need for the development was not questioned, and the extent to which it may affect the rate of progress of devesting is, I think, a matter of speculation.

Mr. J. Griffiths

Will the hon. Gentleman bear in mind that the workers in industry all over the country, and in South Wales in particular, have played a very active part in the company's great success, and they do not desire to see it denationalised at all?

Mr. Barber

I do not accept the latter part of the right hon. Gentleman's supplementary question, but I certainly fully subscribe to what he says about the part played by those working in the industry.

12. Mr. H. Wilson

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer what proposals he has received from private financial groups to participate in the equity of Richard Thomas and Baldwin's when the latter company is turned over to private ownership.

Mr. Barber

The Government have informed the House about their general policy and expectations in the de-nationalisation of steel. I cannot, however, answer specific questions about the current activities of the Iron and Steel Holding and Realisation Agency in relation to possible future operations.

Mr. H. Wilson

Is it not the fact that, at any rate, one very prominent takeover tycoon has declared a very big interest in trying to get at the rich pickings from denationalisation of State-owned steel, and does not that make absolute nonsense of Government policy? Does the hon. Gentleman really maintain that it is better for the industry that it should be run by financiers and take-over tycoons than by organisations responsible to the community?

Mr. Barber

The right hon. Gentleman has made his point, but he will probably agree that it would really be most inappropriate if I—or indeed, any Minister—were to comment on the current activities of the Agency in relation to possible future disposals.

Mr. Wilson

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that I was concerned not with making a point but with getting information from him as asked for in Question No. 12 and which he has so far not answered? Will the hon. Gentleman state what representations have been made to the Treasury and what bids have been received for this nationally-owned asset when it is turned over to private ownership?

Mr. Barber

In the debate which we had on 22nd March I said we were hopeful that we would be able to make significant progress in disposals in the course of this year, and I have no doubt that there will be other newspaper speculations in the months to come. I think it would be most inappropriate and, indeed, would prejudice the statutory duty of the Agency if I said any more.

Mr. J. Griffiths

Can the Minister say if the Realisation Agency can dispose of the equity of a company to which this House has just voted £70 million without the Government being consulted?

Mr. Barber

That is another question. I was asked by the right hon. Gentleman what proposals have been received, and I have said as much as I can on that matter. If the right hon. Gentleman will put down a Question on the other point, I will do my best to answer it.

Mr. Wilson

In view of the unsatisfactory nature of the Minister's reply, I give notice that we shall return to this subject on another occasion.