Clause 7.—(SUPPLEMENTARY PROVISIONS AS TO CERTIFICATION OF APPROPRIATE ALTERNATIVE DEVELOPMENT.) (Hansard, 24 March 1959)

§ Mr. N. Macpherson
I beg to move, in page 10, line 26, after "effect", to insert: as if after the words 'to be made and dealt with respectively' there were inserted the words 'and other procedural matters ancillary to such applications and appeals' and". At an earlier stage, the hon. Gentleman the Member for Kilmarnock (Mr. Ross), whom I do not see in his place at the moment, said, when talking about the words at the beginning of Clause 1 (1) that they had nothing whatever to do with the certification procedure in so far as paragraphs (e) and (f) of Clause 7 (4) relate to them. In saying that, he went a little far, because they have to do with it in that both these two provisions are related to making it possible for the superior to apply for a certificate. At the same time, he was on quite a good point.
This Amendment seeks to give effect to the idea which he had in his mind at the time. It is true that paragraphs (e) and (f) do not strictly regulate the manner in which applications are to be made and dealt with, and it is for those reasons that the words on the Notice Paper are proposed to be inserted: and other procedural matters ancillary to such applications and appeals' which will, without doubt, cover paragraphs (e) and (f).

§ Mr. McInnes
While the Joint Under-Secretary has said that he is giving effect to the desires of my hon. Friend the 1220 Member for Kilmarnock (Mr. Ross), I must say that he has not done so in a very intelligible manner. We have frequently referred during our proceedings, and particularly during the Committee stage, to the complicated and unintelligible phrases contained in the Bill.
My hon. Friend the Member for Kilmarnock and my hon. Friend the Member for Edinburgh, East (Mr. Willis) have talked about the legal verbiage and frequent use of words and phrases which they regarded as redundant. We have had mention of some this afternoon. In giving effect to this Amendment, I want to direct the attention of the Joint Under-Secretary to just how it will read. I hope that the House will bear with me and endeavour to follow me: In the application of this section to Scotland, subsection (1) shall have effect as if after the words 'to be made and dealt with respectively' there were inserted the words 'and other procedural matters ancillary to such applications and appeals' and as if there were added at the end thereof the following paragraphs, that is to say— I submit that that is most unintelligible.
I should like to quote from the Faculty of Advocates, who sent me a communication protesting against the provisions of the Bill being spatchcocked into English legislation. It says: It is desirable that the law, however complicated and unintelligible, should at least be readily accessible. Should the present Bill be passed into law in its existing form, it will be necessary for a member of Faculty, before endeavouring to construe a particular statutory provision, first to ascertain from the Scottish application subsection what is the equivalent provision of the existing Scottish Acts, and thereafter to read such equivalent provision subject to the relevant amendments. Those who have to construe the English provisions will at least be spared the first part of this jig-saw puzzle. The point which I want to put to the Joint Under-Secretary is that during our proceedings yesterday he said: I think that it would be for the convenience of the Committee if I were now to say that consideration has been given, and I can now definitely state that the Government intend to promote a re-enacting Bill immediately this Bill receives the Royal Assent. The re-enacting Bill will be in Scottish terms and will contain everything in this Bill which applies to Scotland."—[OFFICIAL REPORT, 23rd March, 1959; Vol. 602, c. 995.] Will the hon. Gentleman take steps to ensure when re-enacting the Bill after it has received the Royal Assent—

§ Mr. Deputy-Speaker (Sir Gordon Touche)
I am having a little difficulty in connecting the hon. Member's argument with the Amendment.

§ Mr. McInnes
I am asking the hon. Gentleman whether he will undertake to gibe us an assurance this afternoon that when re-enacting the Bill he will amend this provision in its application to Scotland, without in any way altering the sense of the Bill, so that it will be readily understood by the legal and other professions in Scotland.

§ Mr. Willis
I thought, at first, that the disappearance of the Solicitor-General for Scotland from the Chamber was due to the very violent, fighting speech which he made having exhausted him, but, confronted with the Amendment that we are now considering. I think that, possibly, that might not be so. The right hon. and learned Gentleman might really he ashamed of what he is perpetrating in respect of Scottish law.
I have no objection to the Amendment going into the Bill, because it seems to me to make a little sense of the provisions that follow. It is an example of the exceedingly difficult task that the Government are placing upon people in Scotland who have to try to interpret the law. The Minister ought to be apologising to the people of Scotland for doing this and not coming to the Dispatch Box in a manner suggesting that he is conferring a great favour upon my hon. Friend the Member for Kilmarnock (Mr. Ross).
The Amendment does nothing of the kind. While it might be necessary, it makes the Bill more involved than ever. When asking us to accept the Amendment the Minister should apologise for the great inconvenience that he is causing not only to Scottish Members but to the Scottish people when he inflicts this kind of language upon them.